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Vanilla 1.1.10 is a product of Lussumo. More Information: Documentation, Community Support.
Everything Else: **Spoiler Alert** - A Battlestar discussion
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Posted By: lackofcheeseJohn's speech was great.
I think that speech was meant to be a bit of an homage to Rutger Hauer's speech at the end of Blade Runner. -
BEHOLD, THE HERALD OF OUR IMPENDING DOOM:
Also, was that directed by Peter Jackson? Because there were so many extended ending scenes that I expected hobbits. -
All I can say, is I have never been satisfied and dissatisfied by an ending.
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CommentAuthorKate Monster
- CommentTimeMar 21st 2009
I like the ending. It was... the most "complete" ending possible. While the Six and Gaius Angels were a bit heavy handed, most of the ending worked for me. I found Galen killing Tori to be jarring and forced - didn't the series make it clear that he didn't love or even like Cally? Also, why did Cavil shoot himself rather than fight? It seemed out of character.
Regardless, I feel like the ending worked overall. -
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I thought the ending sucked.
The problem was that the characters acted completely stupid or I just didn't care about them.
An example (spoilers ahead)...
During the series, Admiral Adama went through a compelling story arc where he learned to love his son and atoned for abandoning him. And what does he do at the end? Abandon his son. Wow... what great character development.
This is just one of MANY such examples.
It wasn't compelling at all. A lot of the "explanations" were very forced, and at the end of the day didn't even matter.
Interestingly enough... I predicted the finale almost perfectly. I predicted the whole "earth" thing and the "human ancestor" thing, and a lot else. -
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CommentAuthorthaneofcawdor
- CommentTimeMar 21st 2009
Posted By: KilarneyI thought the ending sucked.
Interestingly enough... I predicted the finale almost perfectly.
Moderators: is saying "Fuck the fuck off" a bannable offense? I kind of need to know really soon. -
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The finale went 30 mins too long.
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Posted By: thaneofcawdorModerators: is saying "Fuck the fuck off" a bannable offense? I kind of need to know really soon.
Sorry for having an opinion. Do you think we live in the matrix or something?
You can like the show all you want. I just have a different opinion. Sheesh. -
I was still holding out hope that it would be 1980 or a ship of light would appear..
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Posted By: CremlianI was still holding out hope that it would be 1980 or a ship of light would appear..
Or that the entire thing would be the fever dream of an autistic child? Or that Starbuck would wake up at the end in bed next to Bob Newhart? -
What I Liked:
The fashion robot (it all will happen again).
Finding earth in a primitive state
Racetrack nuking the cylon colony because a meteor hit her dead ship(and dead body).
The Galactica battle.
Tyrol Killing Tori.
The Opera House (but not how it resolved, because it was kinda a minor thing in the end)
Helo, not getting freaking killed.
Oh yea, Athena killing Boomer.. (that's not going to cause mental damage)
The Roslyn's death sequence.
The future having "All Along the watchtower" playing ^_^
What I didn't like:
Starbuck just disappearing.
The Adama's "never" seeing each other again.
and sending the fucking ships into the FUCKING SUN... FUCK YOU! My Damn "Zephyr" flown into the sun.... *sniff* -
There's already a spoiler warning in the thread title, so I'm not going to bother to hide my words:
What I liked:
- Baltar finally having some redemption.
- Roslin finally kicking it. I've been crossing my fingers for that since season one.
- Cavil eating his own bullet.
- Galen Tyrol heading north to "the highlands." I chuckled because this could be either the root of "Gaelic" or the basis for the Tyrol mountains in Italy.
- Six's clothes.
- The old-style Centurions.
- The sheer size of the crash of the Galactica into the base star.
What I didn't like:
- The LOTR-esque loooong ending.
- The supernatural. I've been hoping all along that this was science, and that god was a fake. Now we have angels. Ugh.
- Starbuck just vanishing. That was weak.
- The settlement of "our" Earth. Douglas Adams wants his plot point back. Also, does this mean that we, as the common ancestors of the Cylons/humans are all part Cylon?
- It was never resolved exactly what made the 12 skinjob Cylons fundamentally different from humans. If an MRI couldn't tell the difference, then are they really machines? Or are they just organic machines -- which is exactly what humans are? -
Posted By: Jason- The supernatural. I've been hoping all along that this was science, and that god was a fake. Now we have angels. Ugh.
Well you really don't know what the hell they are. Obviously they lend themselves to being actual angels, but we really don't know what they are. They could be precursors to even the Final five for all we know. I have a feeling the Movie coming out BSG: The Plan, will go into more of the Cylon questions you are still asking. -
Posted By: CremlianI have a feeling the Movie coming out BSG: The Plan, will go into more of the Cylon questions you are still asking.
I hope so. -
Lessons from BSG:
--Drinking heavily helps to solve problems.
--Technology is bad.
--Angels guide us.
When Lee said "no cities" I paused my TiVo and went on a 2 minute rant about how after 5 years into a science fiction show we get the message that technology is bad? I have never seen a bigger middle finger given to an audience of a show before in my life. -
Posted By: ThaedWhen Lee said "no cities" I paused my TiVo and went on a 2 minute rant about how after 5 years into a science fiction show we get the message that technology is bad? I have never seen a bigger middle finger given to an audience of a show before in my life.
50% of all Sci-fi's lessons is don't make intelligent robots and if you do make intelligent robots, treat them with respect. -
Posted By: ThaedI have never seen a bigger middle finger given to an audience of a show before in my life.
Agreed. I've wanted to type an essay on everything that was bad about the final episode. I just don't have the time to do so. It would not be a quick project. -
Posted By: CremlianI was still holding out hope that it would be 1980 or a ship of light would appear..
As far as I understand it, we got the ship of light. It's just that it was a viper.
Honestly, I not a big fan of the supernatural elements they decided to include in the show (though they have been here since about episode 3 of season 1 – Shelly Godfrey, anyone?), the "You know it doesn't like that name" is the closest it can come to some wiggle room about what class of entity we are dealing with. -
Posted By: Pilitus
As far as I understand it, we got the ship of light. It's just that it was a viper.
Honestly, I not a big fan of the supernatural elements they decided to include in the show (though they have been here since about episode 3 of season 1 – Shelly Godfrey, anyone?), the "You know it doesn't like that name" is the closest it can come to some wiggle room about what class of entity we are dealing with.
It wasn't glowing light though ^_^
It has the same stuff flowing through Star Trek. Entities so much more advanced then we are would appear as gods. -
The producers were not shy about the fact that BSG was supposed to be a commentary on war.
That's fine. But you don't tackle the issue by having the characters engage the enemy in battle, prevail in the battle (insomuch as they wanted Hera back) and then abandon everything that won you the battle believing that "fairies" will protect you. (A simplification, but you get my point.) An even more pissed off enemy is still out there. Nice strategy, guys. On a macro level, it was a failure.
On a micro level, there were countless other failures. Just one example... the Galactica is engaged in combat. It's falling apart. The crew is doing everything they can to keep the ship together.
And what do the final five do... They stand there staring into space because they had to match the image in the Opera House scene. Are we really to believe that they would just stand there doing nothing while chaos is around them? Please. It was so artificial.
And did the final five really amount to anything? As far as the story is concerned, I think that the writers did very little with the final five. There were some interesting moments, but in the aggregate the whole story arc of the final five fell flat on its face.
For me, the show started to fall apart when the Cylons were no longer unified. The appeal of the show was the ever-present tension of the human race being wiped out by the Cylons. Once the Cylon race became divided, the Cylons threat was greatly reduced. Heck... for how many episodes have the Cylons been hiding? Ho hum.
It could have worked, but not as written. I appreciate the desire to question the line between humanity and a machine. However, the writers did it at the expense of what made the show so compelling.
And I could go on... -
I'm just waiting for the real final episode to air. The one that pans out to a bunch of kids playing a sci-fi roleplaying game and bitching about how the game went downhill after they let the pastor's son GM for a few sessions.
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CommentAuthorKate Monster
- CommentTimeMar 23rd 2009 edited
Posted By: ThaedWhen Lee said "no cities" I paused my TiVo and went on a 2 minute rant about how after 5 years into a science fiction show we get the message that technology is bad? I have never seen a bigger middle finger given to an audience of a show before in my life.
Giving the finger to science? That is a skewed interpretation. They decided not to overtake a world that had its own existing population of humans by creating a society identical to that that so utterly failed (exactly what the "Lords of Cobal" did and it only had crappy results). They even stated that they planned to bring certain advancements to the existing population of humans (agriculture and language specifically).
They are essentially hitting "re-set" in the hope that society, as it develops its new technology, will make different decisions with their technology. Specifically, that they will not enslave any sentient beings they create.
While I am not a huge fan of the ending, I also don't hate it. It was acceptable.
As for the religious elements, I really don't mind religion in fantasy and fiction if it is done well. I do wish the angels' dialogue wasn't quite so glib. -
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BSG Video games to get that space combat you always wanted.
The first two on the list look pretty good, I think I'm going to try out that Freespace 2 mod later tonight. -
Posted By: Mrs. MacRossGiving the finger to science? That is a skewed interpretation. They decided not to overtake a world that had its own existing population of humans by creating a society identical to that that so utterly failed (exactly what the "Lords of Cobal" did and it only had crappy results). They even stated that they planned to bring certain advancements to the existing population of humans (agriculture and language specifically).
They are essentially hitting "re-set" in the hope that society, as it develops its new technology, will make different decisions with their technology. Specifically, that they will not enslave any sentient beings they create.
While I am not a huge fan of the ending, I also don't hate it. It was acceptable.
As for the religious elements, I really don't mind religion in fantasy and fiction if it is done well. I do wish the angels' dialogue wasn't quite so glib.
This is pretty much my opinion also. It just pains me to see my favorite ships not destroyed in a last ditch battle for survival but thrown into the sun.. :-( -
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CommentAuthorKate Monster
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
Is anyone going to give Caprica a shot? -
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I plan on it, BSG has some currency still, so I'll give anything connected to it a chance until it starts sucking. Though I don't have a lot of hope.
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I don't have much hope for Caprica but I am looking forward to the one that shows the story from the Cylon perspective.
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CommentAuthorKate Monster
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
I have some hope for Caprica... his name is Eric Stoltz. I am a huge fan of his work. -
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Posted By: Mrs. MacRossIs anyone going to give Caprica a shot?
I'll give it a shot. I'm not expecting much, and will bail quickly if needed. I'm hoping that it's a pleasant surprise. -
Posted By: Mrs. MacRossGiving the finger to science? That is a skewed interpretation. They decided not to overtake a world that had its own existing population of humans by creating a society identical to that that so utterly failed (exactly what the "Lords of Cobal" did and it only had crappy results). They even stated that they planned to bring certain advancements to the existing population of humans (agriculture and language specifically).
They are essentially hitting "re-set" in the hope that society, as it develops its new technology, will make different decisions with their technology. Specifically, that they will not enslave any sentient beings they create.
While I am not a huge fan of the ending, I also don't hate it. It was acceptable.
As for the religious elements, I really don't mind religion in fantasy and fiction if it is done well. I do wish the angels' dialogue wasn't quite so glib.
I am not surprised that you disagree with my perspective as I frequently disagree (silently) with you. The finger is given to those people who love science fiction because the positive portrayal of futuristic technology. What happens here? They abandon technology to live off the land. They gave up on technology. Do I understand that some people think that's a good idea? Yes. Do I agree with them? No. Moreover, the idea that these long suffering people would through their technology away was simply a plot device to make it jive with our own Earth time line. It did not survive suspension of disbelief for me. -
Posted By: ThaedI am not surprised that you disagree with my perspective as I frequently disagree (silently) with you. The finger is given to those people who love science fiction because the positive portrayal of futuristic technology. What happens here? They abandon technology to live off the land. They gave up on technology. Do I understand that some people think that's a good idea? Yes. Do I agree with them? No. Moreover, the idea that these long suffering people would through their technology away was simply a plot device to make it jive with our own Earth time line. It did not survive suspension of disbelief for me.
According to R.D. Moore on the BSG Podcast, the destruction of the ships was supposed to hearken back to Cortés' discovery of the New World and how he ordered the destruction of his ships in order to prevent any idea of retreat. Whether you interpret this as them turning their back on technology, that's a personal opinion, but it is one that I don't completely share. -
Posted By: Andrew
Didn't the main characters have a short talk about launching the ships into the sun? Wasn't that talk along the lines of "technology evil" and not "no one leaves"?Posted By: ThaedI am not surprised that you disagree with my perspective as I frequently disagree (silently) with you. The finger is given to those people who love science fiction because the positive portrayal of futuristic technology. What happens here? They abandon technology to live off the land. They gave up on technology. Do I understand that some people think that's a good idea? Yes. Do I agree with them? No. Moreover, the idea that these long suffering people would through their technology away was simply a plot device to make it jive with our own Earth time line. It did not survive suspension of disbelief for me.
According to R.D. Moore on the BSG Podcast, the destruction of the ships was supposed to hearken back to Cortés' discovery of the New World and how he ordered the destruction of his ships in order to prevent any idea of retreat. Whether you interpret this as them turning their back on technology, that's a personal opinion, but it is one that I don't completely share. -
Posted By: The TickDidn't the main characters have a short talk about launching the ships into the sun? Wasn't that talk along the lines of "technology evil" and not "no one leaves"?
From what I remember, it wasn't so much that technology was evil, but rather that they wanted to break the cycle of rebuilding the same culture. IMHO, technology is a very integral part of society and our culture, and it was a logical and necessary step in essentially a social reboot. Whether you view this as demonizing technology, is a personal opinion. -
Posted By: Andrew
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on that one because I think I already deleted the show from my DVR.Posted By: The TickDidn't the main characters have a short talk about launching the ships into the sun? Wasn't that talk along the lines of "technology evil" and not "no one leaves"?
From what I remember, it wasn't so much that technology was evil, but rather that they wanted to break the cycle of rebuilding the same culture. IMHO, technology is a very integral part of society and our culture, and it was a logical and necessary step in essentially a social reboot. Whether you view this as demonizing technology, is a personal opinion.
If Moore intended for the reason to be based on Cortés then he failed to get that message across in the episode. -
Pretty bad analogy. Cortes burned his ships to eliminate any ideas of retreat (or mutnity) so that his men would completely wipe out any native resistance. His soldier's only option was to conquer the enemy. It was their only way home.
Doesn't fit with BSG at all. Yeah... the Colonial ships were destroyed. That's the only similarity. The natives weren't the enemy in BSG. It was the Cylons. By destroying the ships, they hurt their chance of survival and/or victory.
Yet another reason why the writers screwed this one up. -
Posted By: KilarneyPretty bad analogy. Cortes burned his ships his ships to eliminate any ideas of retreat (or mutnity) so that his men would completely wipe out any native resistance. His soldier's only option was to conquer the enemy. It was their only way home.
I'm only saying what came from the creator himself.
Doesn't fit at all. Yeah... the ships were destroyed. That's the only similarity. Yet another reason why the writers screwed this one up. -
Posted By: AndrewI'm only saying what came from the creator himself.
Believe me. I'm not blaming you. My issue is with the writers.
I enjoyed some of the comments in this blog that I found thanks to Google.
It looks like our fears about Caprica may be well founded. -
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CommentAuthorKate Monster
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009 edited
Posted By: Thaed
I can certainly see your point, I just attempt to take series for what they are, not what I would have them be. I can create a million "perfect" endings in my head, but I like being surprised and while I can see failings in the ending, I care less about the agenda and more about the story in this particular case.Posted By: Mrs. MacRossGiving the finger to science? That is a skewed interpretation. They decided not to overtake a world that had its own existing population of humans by creating a society identical to that that so utterly failed (exactly what the "Lords of Cobal" did and it only had crappy results). They even stated that they planned to bring certain advancements to the existing population of humans (agriculture and language specifically).
They are essentially hitting "re-set" in the hope that society, as it develops its new technology, will make different decisions with their technology. Specifically, that they will not enslave any sentient beings they create.
While I am not a huge fan of the ending, I also don't hate it. It was acceptable.
As for the religious elements, I really don't mind religion in fantasy and fiction if it is done well. I do wish the angels' dialogue wasn't quite so glib.
I am not surprised that you disagree with my perspective as I frequently disagree (silently) with you. The finger is given to those people who love science fiction because the positive portrayal of futuristic technology. What happens here? They abandon technology to live off the land. They gave up on technology. Do I understand that some people think that's a good idea? Yes. Do I agree with them? No. Moreover, the idea that these long suffering people would through their technology away was simply a plot device to make it jive with our own Earth time line. It did not survive suspension of disbelief for me.
As the entire series was a literal war with technology, I can certainly see why that particular group of people would choose to abandon it as it nearly destroyed them. Do I agree with the overall message that technology is bad? Certainly not. However, technology that doesn't serve the societies' interest is worthless. I am simply taking the context and circumstances provided by the show and saying that the ending works on some levels. I am not saying that the overall message should be a rule of thumb for all society and situations.
My problems with the ending focus more on the writing itself and the handling of characters, not the commentary on society and technology.
I am sorry to hear that you disagree with me so frequently. As someone who has a great amount of respect for your opinions... -
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What was Earth really like 150,000 years ago? Or why Starbuck was probably eaten by a leopard.
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Ah, Mrs. MacRoss I always respect your opinions and I like you, I just disagree with you (and frequently is probably too strong a word, let's go with now and then).
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I haven't been reading any of these posts because I'm still stuck in 2.5, however something pretty cool that is BSG related:I so fucking fail. Guy creates Mon Cal Cruiser out of Legos. -
Posted By: RoI haven't been reading any of these posts because I'm still stuck in 2.5, however something pretty cool that is BSG related:Guy creates Mon Cal Cruiser out of Legos.
Comic Book Guy says: Mon Calamari cruisers are from Star Wars. I need some more nachos. -
Posted By: Jason
OMG, that's so my bad. It's early. I woke up late. God, I feel retarded. -_-Posted By: RoI haven't been reading any of these posts because I'm still stuck in 2.5, however something pretty cool that is BSG related:Guy creates Mon Cal Cruiser out of Legos.
Comic Book Guy says: Mon Calamari cruisers are from Star Wars. I need some more nachos. -
Posted By: Ro
It's OK, Ro. You're still my favorite of all the weirdos on this board. Especially that Andrew kid. And that Thaed guy. Certainly more favoriter than that HungryFella.Posted By: Jason
OMG, that's so my bad. It's early. I woke up late. God, I feel retarded. -_-Posted By: RoI haven't been reading any of these posts because I'm still stuck in 2.5, however something pretty cool that is BSG related:Guy creates Mon Cal Cruiser out of Legos.
Comic Book Guy says: Mon Calamari cruisers are from Star Wars. I need some more nachos. -
Posted By: Jasont's OK, Ro. You're still my favorite of all the weirdos on this board. Especially that Andrew kid. And that Thaed guy. Certainly more favoriter than that HungryFella.
Yay! But I know deep down you <3 Andrew more than myself. Especially since you share a bond that I could never provide. ^_~ -
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CommentAuthorthaneofcawdor
- CommentTimeDec 13th 2009
Just finished watching The Plan. I've always though it douchey to say something like "I want those two hours of my life back", but in this case I feel it is absolutely justified. Why did they bother? It offered almost no insights, no further revelations. Cavill's a prick? Really? You don't say?
One new character, some 2012-style CG disaster scenes, and some spicy tit/cock shots does not a good movie make. Sadly, the whole thing is little more than a retcon, an attempt to patch up the leaky boat that was the series' plot. Avoid. -
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Anyone watching Caprica? It's creating a pretty interesting mythos so far.
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I'm planning to I just haven't got around to it, I've heard it's pretty good.
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CommentAuthorlackofcheese
- CommentTime6 hours ago
Well, to me it seems like that religious bias that came in towards the end of BSG is going to saturate Caprica. -