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Vanilla 1.1.10 is a product of Lussumo. More Information: Documentation, Community Support.
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Tonight on GeekNights we stumble through some forgotten news, and don't get much beyond that. The newses we discuss are Verizon blocking 4chan, Amazon e-book drama, and Google store view.
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Scott, you're wrong. AT&T's block was from a bounced DDoS that targeted 4chan. moot &co aren't /b/tards, they aren't stupid enough to waste bandwidth on DDoS'ing other sites. There are some end-users who are capable and willing to DDoS places, but they'd just grab a random botnet or make one by just telling anons to run a script. Example, 4chan.js spam. Rym is correct in his idea that the admins don't bother DDoS'ing other places. Anonymous would more likely send black faxes than try and DDoS a fucking ISP. Also, this is just a small case. Only a small subset of the Verizon has the port 80 block, the wireless nonsense. It is most likely an outside party spoofing the packets because they know the internet will go insane over "OMGCHANBLOCKWTFBBQ", further causing trouble for their actual target.
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Shit, that was fast -
4chan status blog, just under 24 hours since the block was put in placeVerizon should be unblocking boards.4chan.org later tonight.
I'll post a more detailed explanation tomorrow, but the issue is similar to the one we had with AT&T last year. -
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CommentAuthorlackofcheese
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010 edited
1) Scott, selling short doesn't imply short-term, though regulations or brokers may force you to cover the position within some period of time.
2) Down with the middlemen! (Unless they provide awesome services)
3) Google StoreView is probably going to hit counterfeiting hard. -
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Posted By: ChurbaShit, that was fast -
Also:sup /b/ moot !Ep8pui8Vw2 ## Admin 02/07/10(Sun)23:53:20on thursday, i'll be at ted2010. this year's theme is "what the world needs now."
True? Who knows, it'd be quite awesome and hilarious.
what does /b/ think the world needs now?
11647 posts and 151 image replies omitted. Click Reply to view. -
Posted By: Owns male genitalia.what does /b/ think the world needs now?
This is the perfect plan. Nothing could possibly go wrong. -
What was with the outtake at the end? Maybe the beginning of Outtakes Part Deux
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Posted By: Owns male genitalia.True? Who knows, it'd be quite awesome and hilarious.
Speaker List -
Posted By: VhdbloodSpeaker List
Speaker list != attendees list. He didn't say he was a speaker. -
Posted By: Owns male genitalia.True? Who knows, it'd be quite awesome and hilarious.
Probably false. Pretty much everyone on /b/ knows moot's tripcode.
Also, check that list under "Christopher "moot" Poole". He is speaking. -
I listen to the book club books at work when available.
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Posted By: NeitoPretty much everyone on /b/ knows moot's tripcode.
Who on 4chan doesn't? Hence why I added the doubt in my comment, since the list I had checked did not have him.Also, check that list under "Christopher "moot" Poole". He is speaking.
And as is now evident, the list I checked was different (also on the ted site). Thanks for pointing that out, I should've actually checked Vhdblood's link. -
Posted By: Owns male genitalia.Hence why I added the doubt in my comment
No-one but Mods can make stickies on /b/ right? How would it be a fake if it's stickied? -
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CommentAuthorMarcusNoble
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010
Hearing Gamestop being compared to a pawn shop reminded me of something. You see here in Maryland the state considers Gamestop to be a pawn shop and as a result, the staff there is required to ask for two forms of valid ID in order for someone to trade in their games. Now I haven't traded my games in there for years, even before they had to start doing that. I still prefer Ebay for selling the games I don't want any more. That or I just give them to one of my friends when I'm finished. -
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Moot is about the farthest thing from a "4channer" there can be (which is a bit ironic). He has a tripcode (which is a grievous sin to many 4channers), he's publicly stated that he hates pretty much every board save Papercraft and Origami, and anonymouses scare him.
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Posted By: NeitoMoot is about the farthest thing from a "4channer" there can be (which is a bit ironic). He has a tripcode (which is a grievous sin to many 4channers), he's publicly stated that he hates pretty much every board save Papercraft and Origami, and anonymouses scare him.
He also stated he liked talking to /tg/, or at least, wished he could have the same conversation on /a/.Posted By: VhdbloodNo-one but Mods can make stickies on /b/ right? How would it be a fake if it's stickied?
Ugh, nvm. I forgot where I was going with it. I need sleep. -
Posted By: Owns male genitalia.He also stated he liked talking to /tg/, or at least, wished he could have the same conversation on /a/.
/a/ is nothing but lolicon porn and wankfeasts about FMA and Bleach. Nothing's ever going to fix that. -
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CommentAuthorWindUpBird
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010 edited
Posted By: NeitoMoot is about the farthest thing from a "4channer" there can be (which is a bit ironic). He has a tripcode (which is a grievous sin to many 4channers), he's publicly stated that he hates pretty much every board save Papercraft and Origami, and anonymouses scare him.
Tripfagging is usually tolerated (perhaps grudgingly) outside of the herpderp boards on 4chan, in my experience. There are a few fellows with tripcodes who have merit on /tg/ for instance.
I'm on the wagon, though. Haven't been to 4chan in almost a week. -
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Posted By: Neito
I don't ever go to 4chan, but out of curiosity, what is the most decent board on 4chan?Posted By: Owns male genitalia.He also stated he liked talking to /tg/, or at least, wished he could have the same conversation on /a/.
/a/ is nothing but lolicon porn and wankfeasts about FMA and Bleach. Nothing's ever going to fix that. -
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CommentAuthorWindUpBird
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010 edited
>decent board
>4chan
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- CommentAuthortheknoxinator
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010
Posted By: GeofinoI don't ever go to 4chan
You should probably keep it that way. It only took me a couple visits to realize I had better things to do with my time. -
Posted By: Geofino
/tg/, /sci/, /lit/, and /m/ are all fairly decent.Posted By: Neito
I don't ever go to 4chan, but out of curiosity, what is the most decent board on 4chan?Posted By: Owns male genitalia.He also stated he liked talking to /tg/, or at least, wished he could have the same conversation on /a/.
/a/ is nothing but lolicon porn and wankfeasts about FMA and Bleach. Nothing's ever going to fix that. -
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CommentAuthorTheWhaleShark
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010
/mu/ is good for finding new shit to listen to. Lots of metal recommendations. -
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/po/ is the best papercraft site on the net.
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CommentAuthorWindUpBird
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010 edited
Posted By: Neito/tg/, /sci/, /lit/, and /m/ are all fairly decent.
These, /mu/ like Pete said, and /ck/ if you want some cooking tips. Avoid /b/ like the plague; one click on a deceptive image is all it takes to see something impossibly horrific. -
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/b/ is pretty much the only truly terrible board on 4chan.
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CommentAuthorYoshoKatana
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010 edited
Posted By: Neito/b/ is pretty much the only truly terrible board on 4chan.
Interesting argument. My counterpoint; /d/. -
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CommentAuthorWindUpBird
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010 edited
Posted By: Neito/b/ is pretty much the only truly terrible board on 4chan.
Of course, most people don't figure it out until they go for themselves and see mutilated corpses, Zippocat, or, y'know, whatever filth any enterprising young /b/tard feels like putting on the internet. And even if they don't, /b/ has no substance anyway, so the board itself is all reposts and old memes.
You will truly never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy.Posted By: YoshoKatanaInteresting argument. My counterpoint; /d/.
Go to /b/. Start clicking images. Eventually monstergirls will look tame.
EDIT: I should note that I have never visited /d/, but I have experienced the overflow such images onto /tg/. -
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CommentAuthorYoshoKatana
- CommentTimeFeb 9th 2010
Posted By: WindUpBirdGo to /b/. Start clicking images. Eventually monstergirls will look tame.
Fair enough. Excellent counter-retort. -
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Posted By: GeofinoI don't ever go to 4chan, but out of curiosity, what is the most decent board on 4chan?
Everything except /b/, and the explicitly porn boards. Unless you're looking for porn, in which case, Go hence and sally forth, young man. -
Posted By: YoshoKatanaInteresting argument. My counterpoint; /d/.
As WUB said, /b/ is worse. After all, /b/ is the only board where you're actually allowed to post scat, guro and furry porn. Not that that stops some of them. Hell, it's possible that more gore has been posted on /a/ than on /d/ after that gore-spammer last year.
Also, /b/ has a 15k+ reply thread after 2 days. -
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CommentAuthorLuke Burrage
- CommentTimeFeb 10th 2010 edited
Hey guys, I think you need to read up more about the amazon ebook deal. You a massively under-informed. The 70% cut to the publisher or author really isn't a good deal considering this is 70% net, and Amazon is free to reduce the price if it wants, to get more sales, and you're not allowed to sell your ebook for less elsewhere, and the cap is at 9.99, so you can't price a new release higher for your fans to pay extra for.
The whole point of the 9.99 price point from amazon isn't that they want to give you a good deal on new releases. Not at all. They lose money on new releases.
What they want is to price every book in the "long tail" at 9.99 too! Want a book? 9.99. That book has been out in paperback for 20 years? Still 9.99.
What the publishers want is price flexibility. They want to say "If we price the book at 15 dollars, and people buy it... great! If not, we'll reduce the price to 10. If we need to we'll reduce the price to 5." People won't pay 9.99 for older novels, ones they already own in dead tree version, so 4 dollars might work out.
This isn't a play by Amazon in the best interest of the customers. This is, in fact, the thing you rail against later, trying to inflate or control pricing. People DO buy hardcover books, and will pay the same price for a new ebook from a favorite author. In a free market, shouldn't we let the publishers charge that price?
You are mistaken or just plain wrong on many other points too, but I'm not going to go into them now. -
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I just managed to find Cosmos at the college library, finally. I can't wait to hear your thoughts on it. :D
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Posted By: Luke BurrageHey guys, I think you need to read up more about the amazon ebook deal. You a massively under-informed. The 70% cut to the publisher or author really isn't a good deal considering this is 70% net, and Amazon is free to reduce the price if it wants, to get more sales, and you're not allowed to sell your ebook for less elsewhere, and the cap is at 9.99, so you can't price a new release higher for your fans to pay extra for.
If this is true, it is obviously BS. Amazon is a retailer. The publisher/author is a wholesaler. They should be able to set the wholesale price at any point they wish, and Amazon should be able to set the retail price at any point they wish. Amazon also shouldn't be allowed to tell you what prices you can set elsewhere. If I want to sell copies of my book for one cent at a convention, and they're $10 on Amazon, tough shit. Amazon's net shouldn't have any affect on the price the wholesaler gets, be they publisher or author.Posted By: Luke Burrage
I have somewhat recently learned the secret of how Amazon makes its money. I can tell you this, when Amazon has loss leaders, they don't actually lose any money. There is a reason that Amazon and Wal-Mart have no qualms about putting prices of things way under where they should be, and will gladly go toe to toe with each other in price wars on individual products.
The whole point of the 9.99 price point from amazon isn't that they want to give you a good deal on new releases. Not at all. They lose money on new releases.
The secret is this. Obviously Amazon can't have gigantic losses, nobody can. However, even if they sell a product at what seems to be a loss, they still make profit. How do they do this? It's all about scale and invoices.
When you buy a book, you pay immediately. Amazon gets that money effectively immediately. But when does Amazon pay the wholesaler for the book? At the end of the month of course! They put in an order, and once a month they settle the accounts. In other words, all the revenues Amazon is making sit in the bank all month. Those revenues collect interest.
You know how when you go to the bank they have a savings account chart? The more money you have in the savings account, the better interest rate you get. Imagine what the interest rate would be if you had all the money that Amazon takes in revenues during a month. Amazon can offer that size of a discount off the wholesale on every single product, and break even (not counting all their business costs).
When you buy a Kindle book for $10 it costs Amazon almost nothing. They don't even have to pay the warehouse people for it. Then that $10 collects interest until the end of the month when they pay the book distributor.
This, and other reasons, are why gigantic stores like Amazon/Wal-Mart can always beat the little guy on pricing. It's also why these gigantic stores just want to get more sales, even at a loss. More sales, more revenue, more interest, less inventory. That looks a lot better in the accounting books than fewer sales at higher prices. -
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CommentAuthorLuke Burrage
- CommentTimeFeb 10th 2010
Posted By: Aprechef this is true, it is obviously BS. Amazon is a retailer. The publisher/author is a wholesaler. They should be able to set the wholesale price at any point they wish, and Amazon should be able to set the retail price at any point they wish. Amazon also shouldn't be allowed to tell you what prices you can set elsewhere. If I want to sell copies of my book for one cent at a convention, and they're $10 on Amazon, tough shit. Amazon's net shouldn't have any affect on the price the wholesaler gets, be they publisher or author.
The problem is that the normal way things work is this:
writer - publisher - wholesaler - retailer - consumer
The consumers money is split between those parties. But the point is that the publisher is NOT the wholesaler, not in the case of books and amazon. This is how Amazon can undercut smaller bookshops and chains. They go through a wholesale. Amazon IS a wholesaler. This means they get twice the cut.
writer - publisher - amazon - consumer
With this new 70/30 ebook deal they are wanting this model:
writer/publisher (get cut of NET, not list price) - amazon as publisher too (who can set the list price) - consumer
That isn't what the writers and publishers want. Publishers do a LOT for authors, and printing and marketing and editing and formatting is just a small part. The biggest part? SECURITY! Publishers are established companies, and can provide advances and long term deals. Nobody has yet come up with another business model that can sustain the creation of novels. I write, but I have a job where I do two night's work a month. Most writers aren't so lucky.
What Apple is offering, and what the publishers and writers want from Amazon, is this:
writer - publisher - market place (selling agent) - consumer
What some writers would like is this:
writer - market place (selling agent) - consumer
These two are the best for the authors, and as far as I can tell, that's the way your favorite authors will keep earning a living. Micro payments and pledges in advance of sales has never worked on a large scale. You said if Stephen King released a novel like that he'd make a killing. Well, you know what? He tried it already, bypassing the publisher and selling to the fans electronically and directly. He gave up that idea pretty quick and went back to the publishers. -
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CommentAuthorJosh Bytes
- CommentTimeFeb 10th 2010
If I'm not mistaken Stephen King was charging per chapter. Who wants to buy a book by the chapter? -
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CommentAuthorWindUpBird
- CommentTimeFeb 10th 2010 edited
Posted By: Josh BytesWho wants to buy a book by the chapter?
It's an interesting concept, certainly; if it doesn't grab you, stop buying. However, it's Stephen King. His latest work probably isn't benefiting from that.
You people and your fancy e-bookery. I'll stick to my dead trees. -
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Posted By: Josh BytesIf I'm not mistaken Stephen King was charging per chapter. Who wants to buy a book by the chapter?
This is something I have noticed. Lots of people out there dip their toe in the waters of revolutionary business models. However, they are too afraid to dip all the way in. The result is that their half-assed attempt fails. They then try to use that as evidence that going whole hog will be even worse.
Again, Steam has proved that this shit fucking works. Imagine this. Stephen King writes a new book. It has to be a good one, people don't buy crap no matter how cheap. Then on the same day it appears in stores he puts the eBook on Amazon, with no middlemen between him and the customer, for $2. Heck, he can probably get away with $5, but $2 would be much better. It would probably sell hundreds of thousands of copies, day one. Oh, it has to be internationally available on day one, no half-assing it. No DRM either. It has to be able to be read on every computer, eBook reader, etc. to maximize the possible customer base. I've never bought a Stephen King book in my life, but I'd buy that. I probably wouldn't even end up reading it, either. Just like I buy games on Steam for $2 and never beat them.
Don't believe me? Just look at these figures.
Cut price by %75, increase sales figures by 1470%!
Let's say the original price was $10 and original sales figures were 1000. So $10,000 in revenues. Nice even numbers for easy math. That means that if you cut the price to $2.50 the sales figures will be 14,700 for revenues of 36,750. Lower price = more money. Yes, that is how the world works now.
The problem is that nobody believes this, even though it's true, because nobody has the balls to prove it other than Steam. Also, because they make enough money the non-risky way, they don't ever bother to push it and try to make more. Even though his prices are high, and he could make a lot more money, King still has high enough sales to be rich and comfortable. he could make four times as much money, but when you're already making millions, why change the formula? -
Posted By: Luke BurrageThese two are the best for the authors, and as far as I can tell, that's the way your favorite authors will keep earning a living.
With a handful of exceptions, all my favorite authors are dead.
More importantly, for all I read, I almost never, ever buy new books. I get used ones wherever possible for a few dollars, or possibly Amazon it if the discount is massive. Rarely, I'll buy one in person if I'm travelling and desperate for entertainment.
The DRM'd $9.99 ebooks would actually get more money out of my pocket that went to authors than physical media ever will, simply for the fact that DRM removes my first sale rights and prevents me from borrowing or buying used.
The solution is simple. Amazon should be free to mandate a minimum or maximum price anyone can list something at on Amazon. Publishers and authors should be free to list or not list on Amazon within their rules, and also free to list wherever else they like at whatever prices they want.
What would most likely happen is that non-Amazon-listed books would sell more poorly, e-book or tree-book, especially when Amazon's prices would almost certainly be better for the consumer. -
On the topic of 4chan, a few days ago they added a 3DCG board. I went out of curiousity. Not impressed. I'll go to CGtalk or Creative Crash or CG Society or ConceptArt.org, all of which have a lot less Na'vi porn and racism and fapping.
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CommentAuthorGeorge Patches
- CommentTimeFeb 11th 2010
Posted By: gomidogI went out of curiousity. Not impressed.
4chan's importance is not the board, but as a barometer of freedom of speech. If they ever start to censor the internet, they will start with 4chan. -
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Posted By: gomidoga lot less Na'vi porn
At least it's related on that board, and only one small thread you can ignore.racism and fapping
Really? Really? The new boards have been over a week old already. /b/ has already left. It's quite a decent board if you ask me. Advice is being given, actual discussions are held, community stuff is done (dorf is a meme already, collaborations too), sure, there's some crap too, but it's 4chan, you shouldn't be looking for a lot of high quality discussions, let alone when you go comparing them to other boards that focus on the same thing only without anonymity.
EDIT:Posted By: gedavidsIf they ever start to censor the internet, they will start with 4chan.
This sounds likely, yes. Only because it's the biggest and best known of the bunch though. -
Posted By: Owns male genitalia.Really? Really? The new boards have been over a week old already. /b/ has already left. It's quite a decent board if you ask me. Advice is being given, actual discussions are held, community stuff is done (dorf is a meme already, collaborations too), sure, there's some crap too, but it's 4chan, you shouldn't be looking for a lot of high quality discussions, let alone when you go comparing them to other boards that focus on the same thing only without anonymity.
I'll try again, but the art is better on the other 3D forums and so are the critiques. -
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CommentAuthorLuke Burrage
- CommentTimeFeb 11th 2010
Posted By: AprecheThe problem is that nobody believes this, even though it's true, because nobody has the balls to prove it other than Steam.
You keep bringing up the example of Steam. I don't think you can apply the findings of Steam to all these other markets. Steam is a single solution for the user for all PC gaming (pretty much), and for many of the games on there, it's the ONLY place you can buy the games.
I guess that's what Amazon is aiming for -- they want to become the only market place. No wonder the publishers want an selling agent model!Posted By: RymMore importantly, for all I read, I almost never, ever buy new books.
About a quarter of the books I buy are new, but I trade them in at a local used bookshop for free borrowing of any of their titles. It means that, on average, I pay about $2 or $3 per novel. Until ebooks are a similar price, or more expensive but I can lend and borrow and trade them just as easily, I won't buy one. I read a lot of ebooks, but so far I've hardly scratched the number that are available for free direct from the authors, or are public domain.
Which brings me back to your first point, which is that I also really enjoy the work of a lot of dead authors! -
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Posted By: gomidogI'll try again, but the art is better on the other boards and so are the critiques.
I'm not saying you should try again. Just that you shouldn't expect it to be as good as the boards you mentioned. I doubt there's actually anything for a professional animator like you to find. Perhaps some inspiration from inspiration threads, or a rare bit of advice or a solution on how to do something if you don't already know all that stuff.
The only upside is that you can post your work on /3/, get critiqued or trolled for it, and it won't at all effect the next time you post up work. (I'm not talking company work of course) -
Posted By: Owns male genitalia.The only upside is that you can post your work on /3/, get critiqued or trolled for it, and it won't at all effect the next time you post up work. (I'm not talking company work of course)
That is true.
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