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Pokemon Black and White

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  • There is a way that you can have a set level during multiplayer battles and the game actually decreases the stats to that level.
    Cool.
  • Can the level of a Pokemon be adjusted downwards? (Yeah, I don't know shit about Pokemon games).
    There are autolevel settings for 50 and 100 in wifi battles, but I don't know if they do it for local play in HGSS.
  • At 10 or 15, most Pokemon who evolve haven't even done so at that point. Those levels are far too low. There is a way that you can have a set level during multiplayer battles and the game actually decreases the stats to that level.
    Maybe so, but it takes soooo much more grinding to get up to level 50. A lower level means less grinding required before you have a maxed out team.
  • Then again, if we all agree to battle with teams that we just use to run through the game, battling should be fun.
    Or we can do something like, all Pokemon must be exactly level 10 or 15. That gives enough levels to have interesting abilities, but few enough levels to make the battle interesting in that there probably won't be a lot of one hit kills. Of course, everyone will still be pumping up their Pokemon on performance enhancing pills, but that's always going to happen.
    Sounds kinda like Baby Battles, with Level 1 unevolved Pokemon. All you have to do is Breed/TM for moves. Since they're level 1, EV's and IV's are practically irrelevant!

    Though if we're going to go with your way, I say that all Pokemon must be exactly level 30. Not too high, but not too low.
  • This is the reason I do not play any game where players do not enter on equal footing. If meta-game constructs affect gameplay, it's just not cool. Collectible card games, collectible miniatures games, Pokemons, MMORPGs, TF2, I've learned my lesson.
  • I've battled competitively and spent long hours of grinding to make a team capable of entering the scene. I had to sacrifice having some of my favorites on my team, as they are "outclassed" by more frequently used pokemon and inherently don't stand a chance. (I hate that they make it this way!) It took hours of breeding, raising, and making strategies. I can beat anyone I battle who has not done this. My Lucario has taken down the Arceus of an inexperienced trainer more than once.

    But even with all that, I still have immense difficulty pulling off a win against another competitive player. It's likely because there were things I weren't willing to compromise on - I didn't want to give up having all of my favorites on my team, so I have some pokemon that could be considered weak links in the OU competitive arena. I was also unwilling to spend the extra hours and mathematical dedication to get perfect IVs on each of my pokemon (which is a thousand times harder than getting perfect EVs), and I outright refuse to use Salamence or Garchomp. It's very frustrating to put in as much effort as I did and still be unable to win because someone out there had more free time and less of a life for anything but pokeymanz. That's a big reason why I haven't tried to build another competitive team since I first got Diamond.

    It really would be great if there were a greater means of leveling competition. I know that pokemon wants to tell us that harder work will result in stronger pokemon, plain and simple. But people will always go overboard and create and environment where those of us who aren't willing to dedicate absurd amounts of time and effort to this video game will never be able to play and win in the metagame.
  • Garchomp
    Oh man, I love my Garchomp. He's so freaking rigged.
    My Lucario has taken down the Arceus of an inexperienced trainer more than once.
    I really don't like using Legendaries any more. While they're extremely powerful when you catch them, at higher levels their usefulness becomes almost nil. They just don't grow well. This being said, I am super glad that Rotom isn't a legendary. My Rotom still continues to be awesome and useful.
  • I hate Garchomp. Everyone and their great aunt uses one. It looks like a dinosaur with a jet plane for a head. Part of it might just be my resentment toward pokemon for failing to make an aesthetically cool dragon pokemon (in my opinion) thus far. They always go with something lame or freaky.

    A lot of legendaries like Mewtwo, Arceus, Rayquaza, etc. have higher base stats than non-legendary pokemon. If they're EV trained and all, then they have an unfair advantage over non-legends. That's why they're usually banned from OU play in competitive battling and put into their own, "Uber" tier, where they're only allowed to battle each other.
  • Part of it might just be my resentment toward pokemon for failing to make an aesthetically cool dragon pokemon (in my opinion) thus far. They always go with something lame or freaky.
    Dragonite is fucking awesome.
  • Part of it might just be my resentment toward pokemon for failing to make an aestheticallycool dragon pokemon (in my opinion) thus far. They always go with something lame or freaky.
    Dragonite is fucking awesome.
    This is correct.
  • It's very frustrating to put in as much effort as I did and still be unable to win because someone out there had more free time and less of a life for anything but pokeymanz.
    This is the biggest problem with Pokemon.
  • edited February 2010
    Part of it might just be my resentment toward pokemon for failing to make an aesthetically cool dragon pokemon (in my opinion) thus far. They always go with something lame or freaky.
    Dragonite is fucking awesome.
    I have one on my OU team. I'm not a big fan of its "puff the magic dragon" look, but it's the best looking of all the pokey-dragons IMO.

    Edit: That's another thing, though. Dragonite has been "outclassed" by Salamence and Garchomp, and if you have one on your team you have to work extra hard to get its stats boosted enough so it can stand a chance at not getting OHKO'd by those two. It's ree-diculous.
    Post edited by loltsundere on
  • edited February 2010
    That's another thing, though. Dragonite has been "outclassed" by Salamence and Garchomp, and if you have one on your team you have to work extra hard to get its stats boosted enough so it can stand a chance at not getting OHKO'd by those two. It's ree-diculous.
    Dude, forget who is "outclassed" by who. It doesn't matter. I play with a bunch of Pokemon I like, and I get quite consistent wins. You can even use UU (Under Used) Pokemon to beat OU's, if you know how to use them properly. Hell, something like a Banette and even a BIBAREL can be beastly in a battle if used properly.

    When it comes to your specific situation, Dragonite is a beast with a far better movepool than his Dragon brethren. Though he may not have the inherent Speed of Salamence, he is far more equipped to withstand Ice-Moves (the main element used against Dragons) and anything coming its way. Hell, Dragonite's moveset is so diverse, you can use him as a freaking Support/Healer Pokemon!

    Also, Garchomp is banned. He's been considered "Uber" for a while now.

    Edit: Also, honestly, if you know how to do it right, it takes 10-20 minutes to fully EV Train a Pokemon. Breeding isn't too big a deal, IV's don't matter TOO much, and battling on Wi-Fi automatically bumps everyone up to Level 100.
    Post edited by VentureJ on
  • edited February 2010
    Dude, forget who is "outclassed" by who. It doesn't matter. I play with a bunch of Pokemon I like, and I get quite consistent wins. You can even use UU (Under Used) Pokemon to beat OU's, if you know how to use them properly. Hell, something like a Banette and even a BIBAREL can be beastly in a battle if used properly.
    I said earlier that I do this already. I've done well with Arcanine and Umbreon. But using Glaceon is a challenge in OU. Her shitty special defense and speed leave me in big trouble sometimes.

    I have a DD/Outrage sweeper dragonite. If I'm able to predict a switch and get a DD in, she's nearly unstoppable. But whenever she's gone 1-1 with a Salamence, she's gone right down. I also choice scarf my Lucario to catch people off guard with his speed, since most people assume I'll be using choice specs or band.

    Or maybe I just suck and I lose a lot because I don't know how to use pokemon "properly". It sounds easy when you say it, but a Bibarel against a Salamence probably won't win.

    Like I said, I haven't been battling competitively in a while. I had no idea Chomp was knocked into Uber.
    Edit: Also, honestly, if you know how to do it right, it takes 10-20 minutes to fully EV Train a Pokemon. Breeding isn't too big a deal, IV's don't matter TOO much, and battling on Wi-Fi automatically bumps everyone up to Level 100.
    Dude, I know. I've done it. All of it.

    IVs do matter, and I've heard people like you say they don't matter much and other people say they can make the crucial difference between fainting or not fainting. Just breeding for 2 31 IVs is very time-consuming.
    Post edited by loltsundere on
  • Arcanine
    <3
    On a side note: I have completely on accident never bought the pokémon game of it's generation in which I could use Arcanine. This makes me a sad panda.
  • Arcanine
    <3
    On a side note: I have completely on accident never bought the pokémon game of it's generation in which I could use Arcanine. This makes me a sad panda.</p>
    If you ever want a Growlithe puppy, I can send you one. I've bred a lot of baby pokes.
  • If you ever want a Growlithe puppy, I can send you one. I've bred a lot of baby pokes.
    I own the game along with my brother, we always get that generations pair, but our father is tech savvy and won't set it up for us or give us the password so we can set it up for ourselves. Makes me a double sad panda.
  • Ah, that's interesting. I just did a bit of research on Glaceon, and she has absurdly high Special Attack. Since my signature strategy is Trick Room, she'd be an excellent contender in that. I can use her very slow speed as an advantage, turning her into an excellent Revenge Killer.

    Also, you really shouldn't judge a Pokemon based on how well a 1 vs 1 fight will work. A Bronzong can't do jack squat to something like a Scizor, but it serves its own purpose. Though I doubt Bibarel can stand up directly against Salamence, its main purpose is to cut down Walls and Bulky Support. I'm not saying it's the "best", but a lot of unexpected pokemon are competitively usable if you look into it.

    Though IV's CAN decide whether you get KO'd or whether you survive with 12 health, if you really don't feel the need or desire to delve into that, it's not going to hinder you too badly. Natures and EV's are what matters most, really.
  • Glaceon works best on a hail team in double battles. Put a scarf or specs on it and let blizzard do it's thing. Bibarel abuses it's ability to double stat boost by using curse, amnesia, quick attack, and waterfall. Most Pokemon can be used in any environment as long as they have a team to support them. Dragonite is getting the move Extreme Speed in HGSS which gives it an edge over other dragons.

    Pokemon can not do their jobs if they do not have the right IV's. I used a Dugtrio with random IV's on a team as a revenge killer. One day an IV bred Infernape was faster than my Dugtrio and swept my team. I personally hate the IV system and want it removed from the game.
  • Six Geodudes.
  • Pokemon can not do their jobs if they do not have the right IV's. I used a Dugtrio with random IV's on a team as a revenge killer. One day an IV bred Infernape was faster than my Dugtrio and swept my team. I personally hate the IV system and want it removed from the game.
    I honestly doubt it has too much to do with IV's, and has more to do with Nature and EV concentration. Infernape's speed can be maxed out to 34-oh blah, it's not worth arguing semantics.

    Perhaps I'll just revise my earlier statement. Having correctly allocated IV's are definitely beneficial, but it doesn't matter too much if you don't have perfect IV's. Having 28 IV's in SpD isn't that much different from having 31 IV's.
  • Having correctly allocated IV's are definitely beneficial, but it doesn't matter too much if you don't have perfect IV's.
    Yeah, you can get away with high IV's, but it still takes way to long.
  • See, the way I see it if I wanted a pokemon like Glaceon on my team I would need to build the entire team around her - either a hail team or start working with Trick Room like you said. That way I'd still have to adjust by choosing pokemon based on what will win and not what I like best. I've scarfed the Glacey I have now. She's been able to surprise a bunch of dragons that thought they could take her out. Her movepool also sucks ass.

    My current OU team is already sorta built around my Lucario. I'm not saying it's impossible. My arcanine got me one of the most awesome wins I'd ever had, sweeping the 4 remaining members of my opponent's team after the rest of my team had been eliminated. His new, more versatile D/P movepool has made him more useful than ever. My umbreon too, has been a pain in the ass to a lot of opponents. Both of those pokemon are considered UU now.

    One of the things that really bugged the shit out of me in OU was the Tyrannitar and Hippodown leads. Sandstorm wasn't just annoying, it also made every battle last twice as long to announce each turn who/what had been "buffeted" by the sandstorm.
  • My team comprises of Pokemon that have a wide variety of moves to make them as versatile as possible. I tried to make sure that most of them have some way to combat their weakness. It didn't always work, though.
    Infernape knows Heat Wave, Rock Climb, Thunder Punch, and Rock Smash.
    Garchomp knows Draco Meteor, Earthquake, Surf, and Crunch.
    Mow Rotom knows Discharge, Signal Beam, Ominous Wind, and Leaf Storm
    Skarmory knows Fly, X-Scissor, Night Slash, and Steel Wind.
    Vaporeon knows Ice Beam, Aqua Tail, Waterfall, and Strength.
    Gallade knows Close Combat, Leaf Blade, Psycho Cut, and Cut.
  • I've never played online, so I'm sure this wouldn't work. However, I will tell everyone my secret technique of winning at Pokemons that I have used in every version of Pokemon I have ever played.

    Step one is to get a nasty ghost pokemon. Gengar and Spiritomb are the way to go.

    Step two, you need to learn Nightmare and Dream Eater.

    Make your ghost Pokemon go first, and make sure he is fast enough so that he always goes first.

    Nightmare. Enemy Pokemon goes to sleep.

    Eat dreams until enemy pokemon is dead.

    It doesn't matter what kind of Pokemon the other person has. If Nightmare works, you are set. Also, ghost pokemon are pretty hard to hit because they are intangible. Lots of attacks just have no effect.

    There are other ways to do the same thing. You can use Drowzee or another similar pokemon to put the other guy to sleep. Then switch to a Pokemon that is strong against whatever is sleeping. So if you put a Fire Pokemon to sleep, switch to water.

    It's that simple. Most people just play for straight damage and ignore all the weird status changing stuff. Sleep is the fucking shit, so go for it.
  • edited February 2010
    Yeah, you can get away with high IV's, but it still takes way to long.
    If it's any consolation, in HG/SS, you can pass on IV traits to your child just by having one of the parents hold a certain Power Item. I'll admit that I don't really like the IV's that much either.
    Post edited by VentureJ on
  • There also are some standard rules most competitive players use. One rule that would counter your idea is the sleep clause. when you play under this rule you can only sleep one opposing Pokemon at a time. So, you sleep them, they switch out and as long as that one Pokemon is sleeping you can not sleep anymore of their Pokemon.
  • Tsuntsun, your problem is that you care about winning in the stupid metagame. Especially the OU metagame. UU/NU > *, and even those are shit. Just find likeminded people and play with them. IVs are just 30 points, and while sometimes that just makes the difference between being KOd or not, who cares.
    I've never played online, so I'm sure this wouldn't work.
    It wouldn't work. I'll show you why by pointing out the ignorance in your post.
    Step one is to get a nasty ghost pokemon. Gengar
    ... meet Ursaring. Ursaring use Crunch.
    and Spiritomb are the way to go.
    WHAHAHAHA-HIIHIHIHIHI! This is hilarious with what you suggest to do.
    Step two, you need to learn Nightmare and Dream Eater.
    WHAHAHAHAHA! Half your move slots wasted on moves that only work on sleepers without a sleep inducing move. Spiritomb can't learn nightmarebtw.
    Make your ghost Pokemon go first, and make sure he is fast enough so that he always goes first.
    WHAHAHAHAHA! Sure, Gengar has 110 base speed, but it'll die quickly with its weaknesses. Spiritomb... needs trick room with 35 speed. Even Magikarp outspeeds him otherwise!
    Nightmare. Enemy Pokemon goes to sleep.
    WHAHAHAHAHA! Oh god that move would be so ridiculously overpowered if it also put pokemon to sleep. HIIHIHIHIHI!
    Also, ghost pokemon are pretty hard to hit because they are intangible. Lots of attacks just have no effect.
    WHAHAHAHA! They don't get any evasion bonus for being ghost type you know. Every move is just as likely to hit a ghost type as any other type.
    Most people just play for straight damage and ignore all the weird status changing stuff.
    WHAHAHAHA! NPCs are not people, and even then, they do use status or stat changing moves. Oh Scott, you so silly, thinking you know everything.
    Arcanine
    <3</p>
    Oh, remember those two I caught Grey? Yeah, I released them.
    Infernape knows Heat Wave, Rock Climb, Thunder Punch, and Rock Smash.
    Ignoring the HM crap... What. Why a mixed attacker?
  • Why a mixed attacker?
    All of my Pokemon except for my Vaporeon are like that. I wanted them to be as useful in as many situations as possible.
  • All of my Pokemon except for my Vaporeon are like that. I wanted them to be as useful in as many situations as possible.
    O.o Thereby undermining their ability to shine in one area. That only works for battling in-game.
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