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Episode 060724 - Lies in Consumer Electronics

edited July 2006 in Technology
Anyone have a good story about a run-in at an electronics store? Anyone know any other things those guys lie about in order to sell more goods?

Comments

  • edited July 2006
    They lie about product warranties. I have seen first hand a rep saying that the product does not offer any kind of warranty, yet it was printed on the fucking box.

    -sorry if you mentioned this in the show, I haven't had a chance to listen to the whole thing yet.
    Post edited by baltmatrix on
  • Don't have any stories about that, but I did have a question from the show. Do things like laptops, cell phones, etc (things with a battery in them) have a de facto UPS?
  • Don't have any stories about that, but I did have a question from the show. Do things like laptops, cell phones, etc (things with a battery in them) have a de facto UPS?
    Not really, sort of. UPS stands for uninterruptible power supply. It's basically just a battery between your device and the wall. So if your computer is plugged into a UPS it draws its power from the battery all the time, and the power from the wall keeps the battery constantly charged. If the power goes out, the computer can run until the battery dies. You probably want to save and shutdown before that happens.

    A laptop doesn't really have a UPS. If I plug my laptop into the wall it uses the power from the wall directly. I can take the battery completely out of my laptop and it will run on wall power. However, if the power goes out, the laptop switches to the battery. So a laptop doesn't technically have a UPS. But from the perspective of a user, a laptop acts as if it had a very awesome UPS. So plugging your laptop into a UPS is silly, just plug it into a surge protected outlet. As for cellphones, I'm not sure if they run off the battery or the wall when they are plugged in. It probably depends on the specific phone model.
  • edited July 2006
    Most cell phones behave exactly like a laptop. While plugged in it will run off the plug (while charging the battery). Then when unplugged it runs directly off the battery.

    Catch - a good number a cellphones WILL NOT work without the battery connected to the unit while plugged into an outsides power source.
    Post edited by baltmatrix on
  • The warranty rip-offs are legendary. Consumer Reports always advises against taking extended warranties.
    Best Buy tried to get me to pay $6 for an extended warranty on a cordless phone that was $11 after rebate. The extended warranty was only for 1 year.

    I put the odds of the phone breaking during the first year at about 1 in 500, especially since any pre-existing defect would be discovered during the return period. I am sure that the warranty did not include the battery. I'm also sure that you have to pay shipping to get your item serviced. Needless to say, I passed. I think I can "self insure" an $11 item.
  • Not really, sort of. UPS stands for uninterruptible power supply. It's basically just a battery between your device and the wall. So if your computer is plugged into a UPS it draws its power from the battery all the time, and the power from the wall keeps the battery constantly charged. If the power goes out, the computer can run until the battery dies. You probably want to save and shutdown before that happens.
    Not really, sort of (See wikipedia). For the most part, the cheap UPS you get in the store (especially the really cheap ones) are going to be a standby ups. This means that they do not draw power from the battery continuously, instead it will pass AC power (with surge protection) directly to the PC. If the power goes out, it will switch to the inverter and generate AC from the battery. When power comes back it will charge the battery up again. You generally will not notice or care that there is a dead period while it switches, because electronic devices (especially computer power supplies) must be able to handle at least a 4ms gap in power input without interruption.

    The slightly more expensive (but still real cheap) ones have what they usually call AVR. There are multiple ways of them implementing this, but basically you still get the mains AC passed direct to your PC, but it is also able to adjust for small changes in power on the input to clean up the output. If there is a major spike or brownout, it will switch to full backup mode for a few seconds then switch back. I have this type of UPS, and I know when there was a slight surge or brownout because it will switch to battery for a few seconds then go back even though nothing else in the house shuts down.

    What you are describing is an "online" ups, where the load is always running off the battery. In realty, they don't really run off the batteries though. They simply run an AC to DC (charger) then DC to AC (inverter) 100% of the time. The batteries sit in the middle so if the AC to DC converter shuts down the DC to AC converter is not starved for power. There is no need in this case to switch at all. In general, you don't really want this type of UPS in your home. They are a lot more expensive, and require more maintenance because the inverter is doing a lot more work. They also generate a good amount of heat and require better cooling. This is why most UPS devices will be noisy when on backup power, as they need the fan to cool the inverter.

    Another thing to note is the power from consumer UPS devices while on battery is not generally as good as mains AC. The output is generally a "stepped sine wave", which is usually printed as a feature on the box. What that translates to is you will get a stair step effect on the output instead of a smooth analog signal, which means more frequency harmonics. For the most part your equipment will not care either way.
  • edited July 2006
    Actually and additional note about laptops: They are better then any UPS. The reason for this is they do not us any AC power internally, thus no power inverter. Your power brick has the AC to DC converter and provides the laptop with DC power. It pretty much runs in parallel with the battery when plugged in and not charging, so it does act kind of like an online UPS. There is no switching time at all.
    Post edited by Jameskun on
  • I love that story about the guy getting a discount on his HDTV 'cause he offered to buy a bunch of monster cables with it. That's awesome, I'm so going to use that.
  • Thank you Jameskun ;^)

    I've never worked with non-data-center UPSs before in my life, and in fact this is the first one I've ever owned. ^_~
  • Hooray, someone knows more than us about something.
  • Not like its the first time ;p
  • Not like its the first time ;p
    Shut up you.
  • I don't have many experiences with consumer electronics since I really don't buy many electronics as it is.

    However, last year, I was in the market for a digital camera (since I've never really owned one) and someone tried to help me. He told me a whole lot of things about all different cameras, all of which was suspicious and vague. I tested him with a question that he should have been able to answer (I knew the answer, but it was a test) and he didn't even know what I was talking about.

    Then I left the store.
  • When I went to circuit city about two years ago when I was TV shopping I reset a few TVs back to factory specs then played around with them to see how I might have it at home (note: I returned them to their display settings after I was done). A rep asked what I was doing and I said that I was changing the levels back to something that I might use at home. He went and got the manager and some muscle. I explained that I wanted to look at the TV in a more realistic way for a home setting. The manager said that I had to leave. I told him that I was a potential paying customer and that I was doing nothing wrong. I was then *thrown* out of the store.
  • edited July 2006
    Not like its the first time ;p
    Shut up you.
    I'm thinking back to that episode where you talked about viruses...
    Post edited by TheWhaleShark on
  • The thing Scott thought would eventually happen has happened. Llano is a combination GPU, CPU.
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