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Book Recommendation

edited July 2007 in Suggestions
I just finished Rollback by Robert Sawyer. It's not very long and it's very interesting so it's a really quick book. I finished it in less than a day.

There are some nice ideas in Rollback. The basic plot is that aliens from Sigma Draconis contacted us in 2009. The astronomer who actually figures out what their message means works on a reply and is still alive (but just barely) when the Draconian's counter-reply is received in 2048. She's offered a "rollback", a medical rejuvanation procedure that will result in her having a 25 year old body instead of an 89 year old body so that she can work on the new message. She insists that her husband get the procedure as well. Then something goes wrong . . .

There's at least a couple of subplots, but probably the most interesting is the ongoing flashback that follows the process of figuring out the first message, which ends up being a sort of morals/ethics questionnaire. The characters discuss the moral/ethics questions quite a bit and there's this nice tidbit about halfway through:

Character A: You realize, don't you, that, as a society, we're on the verge of creting a virtual world so real that it would be indistinguishable from reality, sorta like The Matrix.
Character B: Okay, I'll give you that.

A: Also, we're doing high energy physics experiments that may result in the creation of "pocket universes". . .
B: Still with you . . .

A: If we then created a virtual reality on the order of The Matrix, or created a pocket universe in a particle accelerator, we'd be gods, wouldn't we?
B: Maybe. . .

A: We'd have to grapple with the questions of what obligation we owe to our creation, and what obligations our creations might owe to us.
B: Okay. . .

A: Isn't it hubris then, if we can imagine ourselves as gods, that we categorically deny the possibility that we've been created?

Certainly not a proof, but more satisfying than the "you can't dis-prove it so it must be so" argument. Also, a nice little idea. The book is full of those. I heartily recommend this book. It was great fun and didn't take very much time. Please read it.

Also, I just finished A Meeting at Corvallis, the latest in the Dies the Fire series. It was pretty long and very nice if you think you'd like to read long descriptions of post-apocalyptic neo-medieval battles using catapults powered by truck suspensions and arrows with credit card flechettes. The only thing I don't like about this series are the interminable descriptions of Wicca ceremonies. I've learned much more about Wicca than I ever wanted to know by reading these novels. Not that there's anything wrong with Wicca, but I can't abide ceremonies in real life, so I don't want to read ten pages of cereomony in a story. Other than that, I'd recommend this series as well.
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Comments

  • If anything, such a concept turns "god" into a secular being no different from us, removing any and all "supernatural" ideas about it.  Such an explanation, were it to be proven, would fit perfectly into the skeptic/atheist/intelligent worldview.
    The possibility of intelligent and/or powerful beings is in no way contraindicated by reason: only specific, unfounded beliefs regarding them are.
    More to the point, at what point do we have to care?  At what point does setting my Sims on fire in a world where all houses are made of wood move from harmless fun to godly torture?  How realistic does the hostage AI in CounterStrike have to be before I should feel the need to avoid tossing a grenade into the room just to get that last terrorist?
  • Anyone remember the game Populous? I might have spelled it wrong but in it you and one other player would play GOD and move mountains (literally) in an attempt to have your followers take over the world in your name.
  • More to the point, at what point do we have to care? At what point does setting my Sims on fire in a world where all houses are made of wood move from harmless fun to godly torture? How realistic does the hostage AI in CounterStrike have to be before I should feel the need to avoid tossing a grenade into the room just to get that last terrorist?
    This is an interesting question. If we can create an AI for simulations that acts like it's alive and thinks like it's alive, who is to say it isn't? At what point are they considered "alive"? Do they have to be aware of their surroundings? We aren't, I mean we barely scraped the surface of the knowledge of our universe.
  • This is one of Rym's favorite questions. What if we have a computer that is fast enough and we run some software that is a perfect simulation of a human brain, nerve for nerve?
  • The Turing Test is an interesting approach to issue.
  • edited July 2007
    You have to define "alive," and it should be (for the purpose of this argument) limited to sentient beings. There must be an element of independence/free will to be considered sentient, and there must be the ability to evolve past their original programming. No software or AI element therein can do such as of right now. In fact, AI is a misnomer, because it's not actual intelligence; it's just a very complex system of if-then routines.

    Of course, you might be able to legitimately argue that humans are not true intelligence either -- that our ability to evolve is written into our genetic programming. You could also say that the concept of free will is illusory, and that all of our decisions are deterministic; they are just based on more input than we can consciously decipher.
    Post edited by Jason on
  • I just read a book that touched on this. The author raised some interesting points on intelligence and consciousness. Another problem with a brain simulation is WHOSE brain are you going to simulate?
  • I'd simulate my own and ask myself if I were conscious.  Simply put, I have a large degree of understanding of my self, and I believe I could detect any abnormal responses.
  • A: If we then created a virtual reality on the order ofThe Matrix, or created a pocket universe in a particle accelerator, we'd be gods, wouldn't we?
    B: Maybe. . .
    If anything, such a concept turns "god" into a secular being no different from us, removing any and all "supernatural" ideas about it. Such an explanation, were it to be proven, would fit perfectly into the skeptic/atheist/intelligent worldview.
    This reminds me of Forever Free by Joe Haldeman. I don't want to spoil the ending, but "god" shows up and turns out to be an experimenter-type thing. My favorite line was "First the mice try to get out of the cage. Then they know they're being experimented on. Now they want to talk to the experimenter?" Then when he went away he messed with some physical constants and such. The speed of light was off by about 5%, pi was exactly 3, etc. It was funny.
  • Haldeman doesn't get nearly enough credit. I've been looking at library sales, used book stores, and such for really nice hardback copies of his novels, and have found like-new copies of the first two in the Heechee series.
  • Haldeman doesn't get nearly enough credit. I've been looking at library sales, used book stores, and such for really nice hardback copies of his novels, and have found like-new copies of the first two in the Heechee series.
    Wasn't the Heechee series by Fred Pohl?
     
  • Yes. I'm an idiot.

    I do have a nice copy of The Forever War, though.
  • I thought that was by FAR the best of the three. I read the next two, because, well, I had read the first one, but didn't really like them too much. The first one was some sweet Sci-Fi action, though.
  • Steve, I indeed remember Populous. This game was a fantastic display of sandbox video games. I spent many hours as a kid playing this, and recently replayed a good portion of it to relive the old times.

    In regards to books, I'm making a list and I'll hit up the bookstore tomorrow. Read Elks Run today by the way, fantastic.
  • Yes. I'm an idiot. I do have a nice copy of The Forever War, though.


    That is a very good book.  I've heard bad things about the rest of the series, though.
  • Has anyone here read any Murakami? In general is fine, but specifically The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle?
  • There's got to be some fans of Doug Hofstadter in this bunch. The Mind's I is one of my favorite books - investigating thinking, self and soul. Godel Escher Bach is another favorite, but I'm not sure how to quickly summarize it.
  • There's got to be some fans of Doug Hofstadter in this bunch.The Mind's Iis one of my favorite books - investigating thinking, self and soul.Godel Escher Bachis another favorite, but I'm not sure how to quickly summarize it.
    Those are both outstanding books.
  • Godel, Echer and Bach is a book that I picked up on a whim and had no idea, really, what it was saying for most of my first read through.
    It's defiantly a book you have to re-read. Several dozen times.
  • edited September 2007
    It is time for my annual reading of The Three Musketeers by Alexandre Dumas. I've read it every year since 1994, when I rode Amtrak from Syracuse, N.Y., to Portland, Ore. It got a little boring to look out the window through Wyoming, so I cracked the book....
    Post edited by Jason on
  • Some non-fiction that's very hard to put down:
    Shadow Divers
    Bringing Down the House
  • Godel, Echer and Bach is a book that I picked up on a whim and had no idea, really, what it was saying for most of my first read through.
    It's defiantly a book you have to re-read. Several dozen times.
    I defiantly read it once. And it was definitely awesome.
  • In the last few weeks Rym mentioned a fantasy book series that was recommended to him by Alex. I believe it was based on a historical period. I can not seem to locate the podcast where it was mentioned. Can anyone tell me the author's name or series' name? Thanks in advance.
  • The Prince of Nothing
  • edited September 2007
    For lighter reading, I really enjoyed Have Spacesuit-Will Travel, Citizen of the Galaxy, The Door into Summer, The Color of Magic, and The Light Fantastic. Those are nice quick reads.

    For a slightly more meaty read, I suggest the first 4 books of The Homecoming Saga by Orson Scott Card. The fifth book is basically a really long epilogue. In short, it takes the Mormon mythology and puts it in a fantasy/sci-fi setting. OSC can write a decent story, but he has issues ending it well. See the (original) Ender Saga for details .

    (The Worthing Saga is the best standalone OSC book. In fact, it's one of a rare few standalone books he's ever written.)
    Post edited by xenomouse on
  • edited September 2007
    The Worthing Saga is not a standalone book. It's three parts: The Worthing Chronicle, which is the original novel, 6 short stories, and then another 3 short stories.
    Post edited by Starfox on
  • The three parts you mentioned are all found between the same front and back covers. That's what I meant by "book."
  • edited September 2007
    The Prince of Nothing

    Thank you! I've taken your recommendation on both Eva and Horatio to much enjoyment.
    Post edited by StormingTheCastle on
  • edited June 2008
    I'm just about to finish In the Courts of the Crimson Kings. It's pretty good. It's a companion to The Sky People. These books are set in a universe where the pulp fiction stories about Venus and Mars are pretty much true. So the books involve swashbuckling heroes who are able to have adventures on Venus and Mars.

    I also recently read The Execution Channel, Halting State, and Baltimore. None of those were very good.
    Post edited by HungryJoe on
  • I recommend Grand Theft Childhood to anyone who wants to read a balanced view about video game violence.
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