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GeekNights 20101028 - Spiritual Experiences with Luke Burrage

MrPeriodMrPeriod
edited October 2010 in GeekNights

Tonight on GeekNights, we have a treat. International entertainer and world-class juggler Luke Burrage happened to be in New York on holiday, and we happened to sit down with him in the studio for a few hours to chat. In the first of several excerpts to come, we discuss the nature of spiritual experiences, their relationship with atheism, and our own personal understanding of so-called "peak experiences."

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    • SailSail
      /finally
    • RochelleRochelle
      /finally
    • GeoGeo
      /finally
    • JukeBoxJoshJukeBoxJosh
      /finally
    • Victor FrostVictor Frost
      /finally
      /'bout_time
    • gomidoggomidog
      Jeez, people. We are busy New Yorkers who have jobs.
    • trogdor9trogdor9
      And we are bored and want our free internet radio show! :P
    • GeoGeo
      Jeez, people. We are busy New Yorkers who have jobs.
      So what? How is that any different from anyone else who has a 9-5 job?
    • RochelleRochelle
      Jeez, people. We are busy New Yorkers who have jobs.
      I was only looking forward to this podcast since Luke made that thread about spirituality and Rym asked him to be on the show. I think I will enjoy it when I listen to it tomorrow.
      So what? How is that any different from anyone else who has a 9-5 job?
      Why do you ask these questions? Do you really not understand? Or are you still bitter that Emi told you to stop badgering her in another thread?

      As always, I'm still amazed that Scrym is still able to do this stuff on top of their other own personal things.

      I find it hard at times to be able to do the things I do, or fit it into my schedule. There are so many times when I'm at work, I think about how I constantly want to do x or y, but I'm at work so I will have to do it in my free time. When you get around to actually living on your own, and working full time, being able to manage your free time to where you want to do things you want to do vs. responsibilities can be difficult and at times exhausting.

      I can only imagine how much less free time I would have if I ever had a child.
    • SailSail
      Jeez, people. We are busy New Yorkers who have jobs.
      I was only looking forward to this podcast since Luke made that thread about spirituality and Rym asked him to be on the show.
    • GeoGeo
      edited October 2010
      Jeez, people. We are busy New Yorkers who have jobs.
      I was only looking forward to this podcast since Luke made that thread about spirituality and Rym asked him to be on the show. I think I will enjoy it when I listen to it tomorrow.
      So what? How is that any different from anyone else who has a 9-5 job?
      Why do you ask these questions? Do you really not understand? Or are you still bitter that Emi told you to stop badgering her in another thread?
      Wait a minute, when did I ever say that?! I never expressed any bitterness about Emily's opinion on the Kindle; her opinion is just as valid as my own. To answer your question though: no I don't understand because I've never held a full job in my life. I've only ever held part-time jobs so I have no idea what it is like to after an eight hour work day. While I find the way you have addressed what I said less than desirable, I nonetheless appreciate the input you have given me, for it has actually given me a better perspective on what to expect later on in life. So...the complaining, badgering, and poking will stop from now on.
      Post edited by Geo on
    • trogdor9trogdor9
      So...the complaining, badgering, and poking will stop from now on.
      So no more badgery-pokery?
    • WindUpBirdWindUpBird
      So...the complaining, badgering, and poking will stop from now on.
      So no more badgery-pokery?
      But what of the higgeldy-piggeldy?
    • SailSail
      So...the complaining, badgering, and poking will stop from now on.
      So no more badgery-pokery?
      Hmmm... I see you've played badgery-pokery before.
    • Josh BytesJosh Bytes
      You guys are silly.
    • lackofcheeselackofcheese
      At first glance I thought the title contained "Sexual Experiences with Luke Burrage"
    • trogdor9trogdor9
      At first glance I thought the title contained "Sexual Experiences with Luke Burrage"
      That's the second excerpt.
    • Luke BurrageLuke Burrage
      At first glance I thought the title contained "Sexual Experiences with Luke Burrage"
      That's the second excerpt.
      Yeah, Emily came for that part.
    • RymRym
      /finally
      Finally what? We only do two Thursday shows a month. We also already had timely shows scheduled before Luke arrived. This was ready to go for weeks, but it wasn't time to actually activate it as an episode until last night. It's not like this was waiting on anything other than the standard GeekNights schedule.
    • zehaevazehaeva
      I don't know how long ago you recorded this but Mythbusters did indeed bust the brown note! in Episode 25
    • gomidoggomidog
      The Luke episodes are good, though. There are more on the way!
    • GeoGeo
      edited October 2010
      So...the complaining, badgering, and poking will stop from now on.
      So no more badgery-pokery?
      But what of the higgeldy-piggeldy?
      Flibbertygibbet?
      Post edited by Geo on
    • RymRym
      The Luke episodes are good, though. There are more on the way!
      I had to stop myself from just listening to the audio while I was mastering it.

      Luke also has a good voice for radio. I hit him with a course multiband compressor just to easily amplify him, but I basically didn't tweak it at all.
    • RochelleRochelle
      This was good discussion. I have issues from time to time with my family in regards to discussing why I no longer believe.

      It also makes a lot of sense about how these mega churchs pretty much sell great experiences. I remember going to one of these and it was like a rock concert. Musical performance on various large screens, an area for children and teens with various activities like pinball, foosball, ping pong , and video games, and a freaking Starbucks in the lobby of the church. It was crazy.

      Also, I adore Luke's accent. Accents are always nice to hear from time to time.
    • AxelAxel
      This was all very fascinating and an excellent point and whatnot, but of course, I'm going to come and complain about something. To say that Christians stay because of the spiritual experience is not entirely true. Yes, it is true for some. But, even as Rym says, to say "all x is y" is always false, unless of course x and y are equivalent somehow. Basically, while I could say I've had spiritual experiences from religion, it is not what ties me to religion, nor do I think it ties my family to religion. My mother works in a church, and having been behind the scenes of a lot of the worship and sermons and stuff, while she likes to sing and praise God and whatnot, a lot of it is a bit disillusioned to her. What keeps her faith going is seeing the changes she had in her life by following God. Before she was a Christian, she had a failing marriage, a dead child, and all sorts of other problems. By following some of the natural laws that are in the Bible, and by choosing to rely on an unseen power instead of herself all the time, her choices became better. Now, obviously, she was just making better choices, and they may or may not have had anything to do with her faith. But this is what keeps her as a Christian, not so much her spiritual experience of being close to God.

      Similarly, the ideas of forgiveness, redemption, sin, and human inadequacy is something that rings true in my mind, and it is what keeps me as a Christian. While certainly I have had spiritual experiences, some deeper level of the very personal theology of Christianity is something unique to it. No religion has shown me the same level of simply being forgiven because you ask for it, instead relying on trying to be a better person to earn acceptance of some kind. Additionally, Atheism would require that I act like I don't need forgiveness, that I accept the flaws of humans as natural and okay in a sense, which is something that conflicts with my personal views. Therefore, while I believe in science and rational thought, the very personal emotional attachment I have to the ideas of forgiveness and redemption makes me a believer.

      So, yeah, providing spiritual experiences through other things could help Atheists bolster their movement and possibly make it more meaningful. However, for someone like me, you're still missing a major part of my belief system, and so those of us with strong and firm beliefs don't really find that aspect important. Rather, we have that aspect because of our strong beliefs. Because I have these emotional attachments to forgiveness, I can choose to believe in a higher power of some kind and have spiritual experiences and whatnot.


      Anyways, excellent show, loved hearing your perspectives on this, even though it is contrary to my viewpoints of things, and I can't wait to hear more of Luke.
    • AprecheApreche
      Additionally, Atheism would require that I act like I don't need forgiveness, that I accept the flaws of humans as natural and okay in a sense, which is something that conflicts with my personal views. Therefore, while I believe in science and rational thought, the very personal emotional attachment I have to the ideas of forgiveness and redemption makes me a believer.
      What connection is there between a magic invisible man in the sky and any of that? None. None connection.

      Atheists simply don't believe in a magic sky man, because we aren't little children with imaginary friends. Other than that, you can believe anything and still be atheist. Religions are an entire set of beliefs all attached to each other. Atheism isn't a religion. It's just lack of one single belief. It says nothing about any other beliefs.
    • OmnutiaOmnutia
      edited October 2010
      Man, I spent years as a methodist (I think.) and never had a spiritual experience. Do they offer refunds?
      Post edited by Omnutia on
    • AprecheApreche
      Man, I spent years as a methodist (I think.) and never had a spiritual experience. Do they offer refunds?
      Did they give them any money to refund?
    • AxelAxel
      edited October 2010
      There is, actually. Believing in the idea of a higher power that provides forgiveness for a perceived lack of human goodness is an idea ascribed to religion. Some Atheists may believe in a lack of human goodness, but they have no way of dealing with that belief. They could forgive themselves, I suppose, but if they believe in some level of inherent human flaw, then they find themselves not really good enough to have forgiveness, and that still leaves how other people view them.

      Since I believe in this lack of inherent human goodness, but I can't justify that with how we have all survived this long and still manage to do good things in the world, and I don't believe in a realistic biological imperative to do good (maybe to cooperate and form societies, but nothing much far beyond that), I have to look somewhere else to justify it, and religion is the thing that fits best.
      Post edited by Axel on
    • AndrewAndrew
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