Intelligence: Relative or Absolute

midasiam

I've been puzzling this lately, but can't come to a definite answer. Firstly, Can intelligence be measured. And, if it can, is it absolute or relative in nature.

Thaed

Relative. There's this great scene in Nova's version of "The Elegant Universe" where Greene is trying to teach physics to a Labrador. The dog looks like it's really trying to understand. Given the number of planets out there, odds are that relative to life on one of them, we're the Labrador.

HMTKSteve

Do you mean Intelligence as in the ability to figure things out OR Intelligence as in "how much knowledge you have?"

tuttle88

I think it is totally relative, I spent a fair amount of my life feeling like the stupid one in relation to a close friend, however over the last few years she has been branching out from science into humanities subjects. I've had to explain things to her and always find myself suprised as to what she doesn't know. I've got other friends who are really intellegent but if left on their own couldn't find their way out of a wet paper bag.

HMTKSteve

tuttle88 - ignorance is not a sign of intelligence nor should it be used to rate intelligence.

A bushman straight out of the Amazon may not know as much as you but he may be more intelligent than you. How can that be? Simple, Intelligence is a measure of your ability to learn new things and figure out problems. It has nothing to do with the knowledge you have gained in life.

An IQ test is a test of your ability to figure things out, it does not have a vocabulary test as the SAT does because vocabulary is not a test of Intelligence, it is a test of knowledge.

Brain teaser puzzles are a good test of IQ.

Cremlian

It's relative, but we all have absolute limits to our intelligence.

For example, one might be limited in their ability to their ability to retain knowledge, but they make up for it by having workarounds (like taking notes, or knowing where to find sources) that helps them get around the absolute limit of their technology. So it's hard to say. that Someone who has a near-photographic memory and retains anything might score awesomely on a test without references material while someone else with the reference material might be able to access and use the information better in the allotted time than the person who can remember everything.

Also, some people might not be able to handle higher mathematics, but have an innate feel for how electronics work. For example, my dad can fix everything in the world but can't tell me how many states are in the USA or spell a four letter word right. Is it wrong to say he's not intelligent? Obviously on a lot of tests, he would fail miserably.

HMTKSteve

I had a character in the old RPG "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles" who had some weird mutant power to "talk to cars" to make them work better. But, if he stopped talking to the cars they would breakdown far more often and be un-fixable...

Yes, there are people who are stupidly good at things and are unable to explain how or why that is so. Some of those people suffer from forms of autism, but in a good way. What's the word, Idiot Savant?

Having photographic memory or access to information will not help you on an IQ test as that test does not test you one what you know, it tests your ability to figure things out.

A good IQ test would be to take two people with the exact same training/knowledge and give them both the exact same problem to solve. When they are done you can then assess how intelligent they are by looking at the time to fix the problem and how they went about doing it.

Example Problem: Windows computer has Spyware installed

Rym Solution: Scan drive for spyware problems. Dig through registry. find offending files and delete them.
Scott Solution: Install Ubuntu!
Cremlian (I'm running short of names here) Solution: Format the HD and re-install windows!

All three people were able to get rid of the Spyware problem but...

Rym took a looooong time to do it.
Scott used a very drastic measure and may have introduced more problems because the owner of the PC knows nothing about computers, hence his spyware problem.
Cremlian went for the simplest method that required the least amount of work. If the owner only had a base install everything should be ok, otherwise the owner will be asking where all of his files went too...

Rym's solution would probably be the most intelligent. Scott's, though it fixed the problem, is more of an arrogant solution than an intelligent one. Cremlian took the un-skilled "I work for GeekSquad" route.

Cremlian

So how does Laziness fall into this?

Erwin

I just go by Einstein believe that everything is relative.

Sail

It has to be relative, because we have no absolute intelligence to compare it to.

tuttle88

Ignorance is not a sign of poor intelligence for the bushman, but if you are living in the type of society we live in, where you have access to information but refuse to be involved, or the information you do get goes in one ear and out another, doesn't that hinder your intelligence?

My friend and I go to the same school and live in similar socio-economic situations. I can sit through a history class and retain most of that information and apply it to other situations and she can do it in a physics class, it does not mean that I am ignorant about physics and she is ignorant about history. It means that when it comes to Maths and Sciences, because of the way her brain works, she appears more intelligent and would test better than me. The way my mind works I appear more intelligent than her about humanities. But we may be equally intelligent.

The same with being socially inept. If someone who gets good marks cannot navigate their way from one part of the city to another it is not ignorance. They have access to the same information everyone else in the city has (i.e. a car and a map and an address), if they get lost because they refuse to look at the map or can't figure out how to use it it means they lack real life problem solving skills. But that doesn't mean they aren't intelligent, just that their intelligence lies in other areas.

Apreche

But that doesn't mean they aren't intelligent, just that their intelligence lies in other areas.

This is all true. However, in the same area you can compare the intelligence and ignorance of two people. Also, some people have intelligence and knowledge in multiple areas of varying degrees. Some people have a complete lack of intelligence and total ignorance. Thus, with a thorough examination and comparison you can approximate a total level of intelligence and knowledge for someone.