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It's Time to Build a New Computer

RymRym
edited April 2007 in Technology
image

It's time.

I'm almost definitely going with a Core 2 Duo E6600: it's the optimal point on the diminishing returns per dollar spent scale. Everything else is up in the air. 2x1GB DDR-800 RAM seems the way to go, and I can always add another 2x1GB in the future if necessary.

I'm probably sticking with a GeForce 7 series for cheapness (it'll be more than enough to play HL2 and most of the other games I've missed). I'll upgrade that later, likely immediately after nVidia announces their next product line. Videocards have changed quite a bit, so I have to dig around for some solid benchmark comparisons.

I'm leaning toward the Abit AB9 motherboard, though I'm leery of leaving behind the nForce northbridge I've always been so fond of. It doesn't look like it matters, however, unless I want to stupidly do SLI, which I don't. If I get that motherboard, with its ludicrous number of SATA ports, I'll probably run my OSs on either a single 400GB drive or a pair of 200GB RAID 1. I'll fill the rest with 400GB in a RAID-5 and make the box my personal datastore.

I still have to do a lot of research on soundcards. I have a perfectly servicable Soundblaster, but I really want a professional card. The sticking point isn't price, but functionality in Linux.

I'd post my beta Newegg wishlist, but my work blocks Newegg for some reason. Have to get that up when I get home.
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Comments

  • Scott keeps trying to convince me to get the same Dell he has at work. Thing is, for the same machine I've built on Newegg, Dell's has crappier hard drives and costs a few hundred dollars more. The Dell also lacks hard drive expansion capabilities...
  • RymRym
    edited April 2007
    Dell offers, for $1198:

    Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor E6600 (2.40GHz, 4M, 1066MHz FSB)
    Windows® XP Home Edition,SP2, x32, with Media, English
    2GB DDR2 Non-ECC SDRAM,800MHz, (2 DIMM)
    250GB SATA 3.0Gb/s and 8MB DataBurst Cacheâ„¢
    Integrated Video, Intel® GMA3000
    Post edited by Rym on
  • I'm not trying to convince you. I mean, you don't see me buying one, do you? It's just that it's not really all that bad. I'm using an Optiplex 745 at work, and it definitely exceeds my expectations. It exceeds my expectations so much that I will now actually give Dell a look-see instead of writing it off out of hand.

    One advantage is that it is really quiet. It makes some noise, but I couldn't hear it if I wasn't sitting right next to it. Because Dell has the luxury of selling an entire machine at once, they can streamline the design as far as parts integration goes. In this case, it is very nice how the CPU is in the front center of the motherboard. This allows for a special heatsink contraption which is in contact with both the CPU and the front of the case. This means they can get by with just two fans. One in the PSU that makes a little noise and one near the front on the CPU that is low-rpm and silent. It's a very slick and efficient design that you just can't do unless you design the motherboard and case as a single unit. Sure, you could setup water cooling. It's just a matter of effort spent on a risky project vs. a sure bet with the Dell.

    Another advantage is that the Dell is really easy to work with. Everything is compact and well placed with no mess of wires inside. The easy to remove side panel reveals a wide open motherboard. Every part of the motherboard you are going to want to touch is just right in front of you. It's way better than I expected. Dell seems to actually expect the user to open the computer, and they make it a pleasure to do so. One of my #1 problems with pre-built PCs is that they are almost impossible to open and work with. I'm glad to see that is no longer the case 100% of the time.

    The final bonuses are, of course, the cheap Windows license and the warranty. I always talk about how a warranty is not necessary and how manufacturer's warranties on individual parts are just fine. I'm not going back on that, I'm just saying that there is something to be said for knowing that all the parts work together guaranteed. With a Dell you will never accidentally buy a power supply that isn't strong enough to boot your motherboard. You never have more connectors on your case than your motherboard has headers for, or vice versa. The odds of this happening decrease if you actually bother to do your research, but it has happened to me in the past. If you're willing to pay for peace of mind, Dell offers that.

    The disadvantages of the Dell are that it does cost more money than a custom machine of equivalent horsepower. Also, Dell doesn't seem to offer NVidia cards. At least they aren't an option for this machine. If you need some 3D, and the integrated Intel card isn't good enough, you have to go out and buy a separate video card. It's really easy to install a card because the motherboard is wide open and no tools are necessary. However, unless you get the biggest case they offer, you can only use low-profile cards. Also, as Rym said, there is no room for hard drives in here. You will have to get some external or network storage for your music library.

    Lastly, every single piece of hardware in this Dell works 99% perfectly with Ubuntu Edgy. I can imagine it only works better with Feisty. The only problem I had is that I could not get the integrated Intel video card to use the weird resolution of 1680x1050 that my monitor at work wants. Adding the NVidia card and disabling the Intel card solved this problem as well.

    If you're a geek, Dell is probably not so good. A machine designed for the mass market will not be useful to someone with a specialized need. For someone who just needs a computer with all the standard parts and no extras, a Dell might be a good idea. You might pay more for less, but you save time and effort. Also, whatever the machine lacks in horsepower it makes up for in slick design.

    I personally still probably wouldn't buy a Dell, but I will definitely consider it more seriously than I ever did before. For geeks, Dell still sucks, but not nearly as much as it has in the past.
  • Fuck Dell and build it yourself. The only reason I would even think of getting a Dell is because I can get major discounts through their business website.
  • Actually, hearing Rym talk about it on the show has piqued my interest in building computers again (Damn you, Damn you to hell, I don't have the money to be spending on this hobby again) I did some quick research and suprise of surprises I found Wikipedia to be a very good resource. Geforce 7 series Wikipedia and Geforce 8 series (although personally I find that the Geforce 8 is overkill and way too expensive.

    As far as motherboards I've always been fond of MSI, I've had an MSI motherboard (and video card) in my old computer for going on 5 years now and the thing still runs damn good. The mobo I would suggest. And as far as a Graphics card I would suggest Either the 7600GS for the higher endor the 7300LE on the lower end (personally if I was building a comp now I would go with the 7300LE, for various reasons). I recommend MSI for the video card because, even if newegg doesn't list it, every MSI vid card that I have bought came bundled with a ton of retail games which is a big plus in my eyes.
  • I got myself a new computer this week too. I was almost thinking of going for the 6420, but when I saw that that the 6600 came with Supreme Commander too for free I jumped for it.

    As for motherboard and graphics card, I got a MSI P6N with a NForce 650i chipset and a EVGA 7900GS.
  • RymRym
    edited April 2007
    Post edited by Rym on
  • I can't read your current configuration for some reason. Anyhow, I'm sure this is old school, but I only buy Asus mobos.
  • Rym doesn't know how to use Newegg. Here is his wishlist.
  • Rym doesn't know how to use Newegg.Hereis his wishlist.
    Umm...is he missing a graphics card on that list, or am I blind?
  • Umm...is he missing a graphics card on that list, or am I blind?
    Video card doesn't matter at all: I'm getting a cheapo GeForce for now and buying a better one later.
  • Be wary of SATA CD drives. I got mine and I couldn't even install an OS, I had to borrow an IDE from a friend. Mine is also a LITE-ON, the immediate precursor to the model you have on the list. I'm not sure if it's the drive or something wrong with the motherboard (I hope not).

    Also remember all of the SATA power plugs are on the one cable, so make sure the case isn't weird or they won't reach.

  • Also remember all of the SATA power plugs are on the one cable, so make sure the case isn't weird or they won't reach.
    Not all power supplies are the same.
  • Look at the picture on Newegg. They are all on the same cable, just like IDE power plugs are strung in groups of 4 per cable. It standard practice.

    Also, ignore earlier comments on SATA CD drives. This was caused by old programming in BIOS. Just be sure to hook up drives starting in port one and not leaving gaps and it should all work. BIOS checks the ports sequentially and breaks if it sees an empty.
  • Look at the picture on Newegg. They are all on the same cable, just like IDE power plugs are strung in groups of 4 per cable. It standard practice.

    Also, ignore earlier comments on SATA CD drives. This was caused by old programming in BIOS. Just be sure to hook up drives starting in port one and not leaving gaps and it should all work. BIOS checks the ports sequentially and breaks if it sees an empty.
    HAHA! The answer.
  • Sigh...

    So, I'm reading numerous reports of fatal Linux problems with the AB9 motherboard I want...

    -back to the drawing board-
  • Yeah. One very annoying thing about Linux is that there isn't enough reliable and easy to find information about hardware compatibility. I mean sure, it works with most hardware. My Dell at work works with Ubuntu 100%. However, the newest geeky motherboards often come with advanced features not found elsewhere. When it comes to fancy on-board sound cards, dual gigabit ethernet cards or lots of RAID SATA controllers, there is no telling how well they will work under Linux until you try. This is not acceptable. I want to buy a motherboard while also being confident that 100% of its features will work perfectly. I will not settle for less.
  • I'm in the upgrade market too, and your configuration sounds a lot like mine.

    Luckily, a friend of mine recently built a 6600-based machine which runs feisty quite well. I'm taking some of his recommendations to replace my cursed Abit motherboard and underwhelming Athlon X2. I'm even thinking of buying his ridiculous, enormous, heavy enclosure; after all, a stationary computer is a stationary computer.

    My general advice for linux compatibility is to find other people who are using it successfully, and consider their hardware.
  • I'm in the upgrade market too, and your configuration sounds a lot like mine.

    Luckily, a friend of mine recently built a 6600-based machine which runs feisty quite well. I'm taking some of his recommendations to replace my cursed Abit motherboard and underwhelming Athlon X2. I'm even thinking of buying his ridiculous, enormous, heavy enclosure; after all, a stationary computer is a stationary computer.

    My general advice for linux compatibility is to find other people who are using it successfully, and consider their hardware.
    Say. If you're not using that X2 anymore...
  • I'm in the upgrade market too, and your configuration sounds a lot like mine.

    Luckily, a friend of mine recently built a 6600-based machine which runs feisty quite well. I'm taking some of his recommendations to replace my cursed Abit motherboard and underwhelming Athlon X2. I'm even thinking of buying his ridiculous, enormous, heavy enclosure; after all, a stationary computer is a stationary computer.

    My general advice for linux compatibility is to find other people who are using it successfully, and consider their hardware.
    Say. If you're not using that X2 anymore...
    Scott, you're forgetting who we're talking about here. The reason he's not using it anymore is because it lit on fire, launched off, flew around the room, then exploded.
  • I'm in the upgrade market too, and your configuration sounds a lot like mine.

    Luckily, a friend of mine recently built a 6600-based machine which runs feisty quite well. I'm taking some of his recommendations to replace my cursed Abit motherboard and underwhelming Athlon X2. I'm even thinking of buying his ridiculous, enormous, heavy enclosure; after all, a stationary computer is a stationary computer.

    My general advice for linux compatibility is to find other people who are using it successfully, and consider their hardware.
    Say. If you're not using that X2 anymore...
    Scott, you're forgetting who we're talking about here. The reason he's not using it anymore is because it lit on fire, launched off, flew around the room, then exploded.
    Damnit.

    Interestingly enough, AMD motherboards are much more likely to be Linux compatible. This is again, NForce related. NForce has been an AMD platform for far longer than it has been an Intel platform. Most AMD Nforce boards seem to "just work", SATA, sound and all. NVidia is very smart to hire engineers that simply submit patches to the Linux kernel to make sure NVidia hardware is compatible.
  • edited April 2007
    Check out the evga GeForce 7300 256Mb pci-e card on Newegg. I'm running a pair of them in Ubuntu with the restricted drivers, and they are working fine. Also, they are powerful enough under windows to run BF2142 at a fairly high res (1440x900, I believe) with decent frame rates. And They are strong enough to push out a decent image and decent performance with Stalker, believe it or not. They have gone up since I bought my pair, but until an inexpensive dx10 card comes out (around $150 per), they will more than do the trick.

    Plus, I'll have spare pci-e cards in case I want to build a new system for my girlfriend down the line.
    Post edited by Rym on
  • Score!

    According to some guy on the internet, this motherboard works perfectly in Ubuntu Feisty as of three days ago. It's a little pricey, but now I have a list of components that I know will work. It looks like some of the issues people were having earlier with similar motherboards have been resolved very recently.

    I'm getting ever closer to trading bits on a bank's computer for a box full of metal and plastic. ^_^
  • That motherboard seems pretty nice. The built in wifi and external SATA connector are cool.
  • Where is this random guy on the Internet? Everywhere I read says nothing but random freezes when using Ubuntu on the P5B. Of course, that's with Edgy, and there's barely any Feisty information.
  • Where is this random guy on the Internet?
    Here. Look at the last post.
  • Where is this random guy on the Internet?
    Here. Look at the last post.
    Yeah, I just did a bunch of research as well. Apparently most, but not all, of the problems people were having were in Edgy. Edgy uses the 2.6.17 Kernel. Feisty uses the 2.6.20 kernel, and it works much better. By the time I buy a new computer, I think everything will be just perfect.
  • Hence, I'm going to bite the bullet. Even if the motherboard I get isn't 100% in Linux right away, I'll wager it will be in fairly short order. I can suffer through a month or two of Windows if need be, but I can't live with schezar.haus for much longer. ^_~

    It is, however, frustrating how the majority of people who have a problem don't say what version/kernel/whatever they're using.

  • It is, however, frustrating how the majority of people who have a problem don't say what version/kernel/whatever they're using.
    People who are smart enough to know that sort of thing don't have problems.
  • I'll just say that I got a P6N and the only problem I've had is that when the motherboard detects a new bootable device of of USB it puts it at the front of the boot queue, and isn't smart enough to realize that it can't boot from my ipod.
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