Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
This forum is in permanent archive mode. Our new active community can be found here.
Super Street Fighter IV
Might as well start with a new thread for a new game.
First, it is so awesome that all the characters are unlocked from the get-go. Are there any secret locked characters? Perhaps the mysterious 15?
Other than that, my goal right now is to do every trial with every character. I'm actually amazed at how many of them I can do without any trouble, even some complicated ones.
Also, I've been playing on the XBL, and actually doing pretty well. I think I only actually won once or twice, but the competition isn't insane. The only time I got pissed was fighting, of course, my mortal enemy Zangief. All he did was spin over and over again, and I couldn't do shit! I even tried EX Head Stop, and the spin beat it! WTF! Did they jack up the double lariat or something?
First, it is so awesome that all the characters are unlocked from the get-go. Are there any secret locked characters? Perhaps the mysterious 15?
Other than that, my goal right now is to do every trial with every character. I'm actually amazed at how many of them I can do without any trouble, even some complicated ones.
Also, I've been playing on the XBL, and actually doing pretty well. I think I only actually won once or twice, but the competition isn't insane. The only time I got pissed was fighting, of course, my mortal enemy Zangief. All he did was spin over and over again, and I couldn't do shit! I even tried EX Head Stop, and the spin beat it! WTF! Did they jack up the double lariat or something?
Comments
But yeah the game's great. Most of my friends have had the game since last week, and are real Street Fighter nuts, so they've had time to practice and get to really high skill levels for even the new characters. Needless to say, I've been their whipping boy...
I did trials, the way Guy moves is really weird. Makoto also moves very strangely. She goes all slow, but her dashes are way fast. Neither is as weird as El Fuerte.
Also, I'm thinking I will practice a lot with Dee Jay. He's got charge moves, which I'm good at, but he also has a projectile, which I find myself desperately wanting quite often when I'm playing with M. Bison.
What do you guys think about the replay and watch modes? I find the depth of what it offers (being able to see both the button inputs and the damage/scaling/stun info for both players) to offer at once a pleasing amount of depth, and a worrying rabbit hole of minutia to fall down. I've never been a frame-counter, but this game seems to offer an easier inroad to those levels than most.
Fox
Imagine if Pokemon was up front about EV training by showing EVs right there in the pokedex, where what they should really do is remove it completely.
There are many layers of depth in the Street Fighter series, especially post Alpha. What I was referring to as worrying for me was not the bearing of the depth but rather an easier slide into such depths. There are a number of different layers, like so:
-The base these buttons kick and these buttons punch.
-special moves, series of button presses to throw fire-balls and the like.
-combos, mixing levels one and two to create strings of moves
-priorities and cross-over (here's where the depth becomes important) some moves over-ride others, hidden rules you might never notice like preloading, buffering and the like.
-Chain-combo's, cancels and other very precise timing related combo's. (Here's where the replays come into it)
-Frame specific minutia like "input leniency," Hit-boxes and frame-specific invincibility windows.
I've always been able to get into the Street Fighter games to a certain degree, (around step four on the above example) but never had the urge to dig up the resources to go deeper. Now that it is so much easier the temptation to dig deeper is much greater. Well, it is much greater for me. For many I could see this having the opposite effect of giving them a glimpse of how much deeper there is to go, frustrating them, and turning them away.
^.^
For such a hardcore and difficult game there are a fuck ton of people playing it.
For example "crossovers." A crossover is an attack that seems to strike from one side, but actually strikes from the other. An example situation: Opponent is ducking, facing right (so blocking left). Sakura's jumping medium kick, moving from the right side of the screen to the left. Normally holding left should block the attack, but that particular attack is a crossover. Therefore it actually hits further out than the attack looks like it should, so to block it the Opponent must actually hold right.
These are much easier in pictures than in text...
Anyway, there are a number of attacks, usually one or two per character that have that particular property. Mostly this is either something you have to look up, or something that you notice through extended play and practice.
Another important detail, especially when it comes to pulling off combos, is that the inputs for moves can overlap. For example: The motion for Ken's "dragon punch" is forward, down, down-forward and punch, but you can combo from a ducking medium punch into the dragon punch. Pressing down and punch, and than starting the forward, down, down/forward punch takes a long enough time that it is very hard to combo. You can, however, press forward, than down and punch, than down/forward and punch. The down and punch will register as a ducking punch, and than down/forward and punch will register as the end of the forward, down, down/forward and punch set. Thus the dragon-punch can be executed even before the ducking punches animation finishes, thus linking them together and creating a combo.
Of course not every move can be combined, but for those that can this makes it a lot easier.
You are already a lot deeper than you think, just knowing that there are layers to the play that you haven't reached yet. Most casual players just assume that either they don't understand the system and that's why something didn't work, or that it was just a mistake. (I'm amazed how often I hear "that should have worked!" or "That's not fair!" when playing in public or with new gamers.)
I feel like I've taken maybe a bit too much space here... If there's more interest I'd be up for starting a StreetFighter or even just fighting games in general, strategy thread.
(Fighting)Fox
I'd offer to help with that myself, but I went for the free online with friends console version.
-Option Selecting: Placing two commands into the game before any single command can be executed. The game decides which of the two inputs is the best and executes this option. Before you think this is completely broken option selects follow strict rules that can be exploited by your opponent to get you punished for attempting them. I personally do not like them as they give certain characters vast advantages, (mainly characters with invincibility frame-non charge moves) but in the new game the developers seem to have taken into account the advantages of having good option selects and balanced the game to account for this.
-Safe Jumping: Jumping in on an opponent while they rise from a knock down with specific timing so that they are forced to block your attack or get punished for doing anything. You time your jump such that you hit the opponent at the exact frame they get up and you are also just about to land. As such any normal attack the opponent does will be countered as their move will still need to start up (minimum 3 frames for all normal moves, some ultras/supers come out quicker). This forces the opponent to block or attack or be hit. If your opponent does an attack that is invincible on start up (Say Sagat's uppercut) you will be able to block before their attack comes out as you will land and be able to block before the hit frames of your opponent's attack appear. As such you can not be punished for doing a Safe Jump. Hence the name Safe Jump. This technique has allot of details and this is a very brief explanation.
-Hit confirming: Doing combo's that you visually see are connecting before you finish them. During the combo you change what actions you will do depending on if your opponent is blocking or being hit. This is easier for combos that involve multiple hits. This skill is far more basic then the above two. I already sort of do this but I need to implement it more in my game.
I fear that I may not be able to implement the above 3 points in my game effectively and I will stop getting better, but I will not find out till I try. I have SSF4 for xbox now and I look forward to facing any challengers from the forum's.
Fuck the safe jump! I get knocked down by some really good players, then I never get up again because they continuously safe jump me. Anyone have any good ideas for what I should do? My wake-up game right now is pretty much limited to attempting to block, EX Head Stomp, Focus attack.
Here are two questions I have.
I was fighting Hakan once, and he did something so cheap. Basically when I was on the ground, he would get next to me and focus attack. He had obviously practice releasing the focus at the exact right moment so that I was re-crumpled immediately upon waking. I couldn't figure out for the life of me how to avoid this. I managed to keep my distance and do some damage, but I lost to it in the end. It was really disheartening when he did it as the final blow against me in the corner. What should I do? Can I do a focus on wake to use the armor and counter?
Secondly can someone give me a specific example of an option select? Tell me exactly what buttons are pressed, what that causes to happen in game, and why it's good/bad.
It is tempting to over-use popups, because it can feel like a safe move and if people are pressing you hard they can be really useful, but if you use them too much and your opponent gets wise to them they also tend to be moves that can be punished pretty harshly on a whiff or a block.
Certainly not unlimited, but I do very much enjoy the strategy that these games allow!
Also, you know how in kung-fu movies, there is always the cliche of the disciple having to learn to fight using only the simplest thing, and nothing fancy. No, we will not teach you to use swords, sticks, nunchuks, or anything else. You must first beat all these opponents with just your pinky finger!
Well, I've sort of been doing that with Bison's standing roundhouse. It feels so cheap, boring, and wrong, that I can destroy so many people almost entirely with that one move, but in trying to win using just one button, I've intuitively learned a lot about some of the hitbox mechanics and timings and such. It's also provided me with a solution for those people who love to do the repeated cross-ups. I just kick them in the junk every time they jump over my head.