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Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality

balderdashbalderdash
edited September 2010 in Everything Else
Holy crap. Smart Harry Potter schools everyone.

Maybe you've heard of this, and maybe you haven't. Maybe it was a Thing of the Day. I can't find any mention of it on the forum here. You need to know.

Yes, you.

Make one change to the Harry Potter universe: Petunia marries a kind, intelligent Ivy League professor instead of thuggish Dursley. Harry is consequently raised with kindness and surrounded by books. He turns out to be a really fuckin' smart kid.

Rational hijinks ensue.

It's on fanfiction.net, but don't judge it for that. It's written by an AI researcher and specialist in decision-making and game theory, and it's as much a teaching tool about how to think as it is a story. It's also profoundly satisfying if you read Harry Potter and hated how Harry never did, well, anything, because he was a traumatized victim of child abuse and not very smart.

Anyway, go read this shit. It's amazing and you might learn something. At the least you will be amused for an afternoon.

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5782108/1/Harry_Potter_and_the_Methods_of_Rationality

Be warned: it's an ongoing work, so don't expect it to wrap up neatly when you get to the end. He updates it every week or so.

You can also read Less Wrong, a rationalist blog to which the author contributes.
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Comments

  • outlawpoetoutlawpoet
    It's worth the read if you like funny metafiction, but purists be aware, this is not a 'single change', Eliezer freely moves around a lot of stuff in the Potterverse, on the grounds that the original was incoherent, or just less fun. Characters are wildly OOC occasionally, and much of the metaphysics and rules of magic have been reworked.

    Also, many of the in-jokes and extended diatribes are aimed at other fanfiction stories, and/or online arguments.

    (and some of the science is a bit speculative).

    But it is fantastic stuff, really. I read every new chapter twice.
  • balderdashbalderdash
    Well, okay, yeah, some other stuff does cascade out from that "single change." He's up front about the fact that he had to make the, er... "opposition" smarter, too, for example, because a smart hero with a stupid enemy doesn't make for an interesting story.

    His other fiction is interesting, too, incidentally, although "Three Worlds Collide" might disturb some people.
  • lackofcheeselackofcheese
    I've now read up to the last chapter released to date, and I admit it has been rather entertaining.
  • Victor FrostVictor Frost
    Its like Ender's Game meets Harry Potter! I love it! It's the first story in a long time to make the fire in my soul to burn once again.
  • StarfoxStarfox
    edited September 2010
    Isn't Eliezer a singularity nut?

    I actually dislike Harry Potter. What sort of twisted people are those wizards? The powers they have could be used for the betterment of the human race to an absurd degree, but the ministry's conspiracy to keep muggles in the dark is pure evil. The ability to say a word and instantaneously teleport anywhere or fix a broken object would have tremendous benefit for humanity.

    Imagine a scientist today discovers a ridiculously easy method by which any object can be made to fly. It would rock physics to its foundations. Production costs for goods are drastically reduced, uncountable accidents are avoided, travel becomes instantly safer, faster, and cheaper. Instant Nobel for our scientist, and he is a world hero. In Potter-world, what do you get for even letting non-wizards see any magic? Magic jail.

    I would actually love to read a story where our guy is trying to overthrow The Man and his conspiracy to keep magic out of the unknowing population's hands. Call him Prometheus the Wizard. Does anything like this exist?
    Post edited by Starfox on
  • balderdashbalderdash
    Isn't Eliezer a singularity nut?
    Yes, and kudos for knowing who he is and recognizing that, but that doesn't mean he's wrong about everything.
    I actually dislike Harry Potter. What sort of twisted people are those wizards? The powers they have could be used for the betterment of the human race to an absurd degree, but the ministry's conspiracy to keep muggles in the dark is pure evil. The ability tosay a wordand instantaneously teleport anywhere or fix a broken object would have tremendous benefit for humanity.

    Imagine a scientist today discovers a ridiculously easy method by which any object can be made to fly. It would rock physics to its foundations. Production costs for goods are drastically reduced, uncountable accidents are avoided, travel becomes instantly safer, faster, and cheaper. Instant Nobel for our scientist, and he is a world hero. In Potter-world, what do you get for even letting non-wizards see any magic? Magic jail.

    I would actually love to read a story where our guy is trying to overthrow The Man and his conspiracy to keep magic out of the unknowing population's hands. Call him Prometheus the Wizard. Does anything like this exist?
    ...Have you tried reading the story in question?
  • ChurbaChurba

    ...Have you tried reading the story in question?
    Okay, spoiler coming up for all of you -

    Half the Social commentary in Harry Potter comes from the fact that While the muggle world doesn't have magic, they have technology, which the wizards don't understand in the slightest. They're so out of touch with the muggle world, some don't even know how to dress themselves in rough accordance with it as so to pass without using spells to just hide yourself. The point is that the wizards are disdainful of muggles in the extreme, to the point where their...Magicisim? Whatever. Their chosen brand of space racism has actually cheated them out of a lot of things that would be useful to them, such as computers, medicine, vehicles, weaponry, so on - That these people they are ignoring because they lack the ability to do magic have compensated quite well, and even manage things beyond the knowledge and ability of the greatest wizards - as this particular fan-fiction points out, Going to the moon, for example.
  • WalkerWalker
    Half the Social commentary in Harry Potter comes from the fact that While the muggle world doesn't have magic, they have technology, which the wizards don't understand in the slightest.
    This is one of the weirder uses of the shift key I've seen from you.
  • ChurbaChurba
    This is one of the weirder uses of the shift key I've seen from you.
    That's because you've not seen what I did to your mother with it.
  • OmnutiaOmnutia
    This is one of the weirder uses of the shift key I've seen from you.
    Have we had a Stan Lee thread yet?
  • ChurbaChurba
    edited September 2010
    This is one of the weirder uses of the shift key I've seen from you.
    Weirdly, If you read that aloud, the extra capitals fit pretty closely with my natural speaking cadence and flow - I've only just noticed that.
    Post edited by Churba on
  • WindUpBirdWindUpBird
    Wierdly
    As an homage to you, I will now only spell "weird" as "wyrd."
  • GreyHugeGreyHuge
    When I saw Sonic post I started reading this. Now I can't stop reading, it's 12:44 and I have school tomorrow at 8:30.

    HALP
  • ChurbaChurba
    As an homage to you, I will now only spell "weird" as "wyrd."
    GAH. I do that all the fucking time but normally, I remember to spell check.
  • WindUpBirdWindUpBird
    edited September 2010
    When I saw Sonic post I started reading this. Now I can't stop reading, it's 12:44 and I have school tomorrow at 8:30.

    HALP
    Have you heard of Shinji and Warhammer 40k?

    I think you'll like it.

    EDIT: Also, a byline could be "And Asuka and TTGL."
    Post edited by WindUpBird on
  • Victor FrostVictor Frost
    edited September 2010
    When I saw Sonic post I started reading this. Now I can't stop reading, it's 12:44 and I have school tomorrow at 8:30.

    HALP
    I've been reading it on my phone pretty much all day. This guy's writing is pretty fucking good and it makes me even more convinced that I need a kindle.
    Post edited by Victor Frost on
  • GreyHugeGreyHuge
    Have you heard ofShinji and Warhammer 40k?

    I think you'll like it.

    EDIT: Also, a byline could be "And Asuka and TTGL."
    I hate you. I hate you SO much.
  • WindUpBirdWindUpBird
    Have you heard ofShinji and Warhammer 40k?

    I think you'll like it.

    EDIT: Also, a byline could be "And Asuka and TTGL."
    I hate you. I hate you SO much.
    Why go to sleep when you can watch EVA 01 kill shit fueled on prayers to its machine spirit and Shinji's holy rage for the Greater Good?
  • lackofcheeselackofcheese
    When I saw Sonic post I started reading this. Now I can't stop reading, it's 12:44 and I have school tomorrow at 8:30.

    HALP
    Hehe, yeah; I skipped a lecture this morning because I was sleeping after having finished the story at 4am or so.
  • StarfoxStarfox
    ...Have you tried reading the story in question?
    No. Is that what this is about? Using somebody else's story just seems so... Unprofessional.
  • lackofcheeselackofcheese
    edited September 2010
    A quote I found from the author's notes for Ch. 43-46:
    I think of myself as someone who deliberately cuts against the grain of status and prestige. Which, of course, is something that everyone likes to think about themselves. But then again, my claim does have a certain credibility, because I had a reputation as a "real" writer before I started writing Harry Potter fanfiction, and I did that with malice aforethought to intentionally drop myself down multiple levels on the Geek Hierarchy. Snobbery offends me; I am offended by people who are prejudiced against beauty because of its form or its medium. I am offended by people who think "Calvin and Hobbes" can't be real art because it's a comic strip, and I can curse them with no darker fate than that they go look at some ugly, pointless, fake "modern art" that will impress their friends more. And I am equally offended by people who look down on fanfiction because it's fanfiction, who'd take something beautiful like "Always and Always" and turn up their noses at it. So I write Harry Potter fanfiction and be damned to them all. Someday, when I think I can get away with it, I will write deep intellectual self-insert pornography that is even better than MoR just so I can watch people's heads explode.
    Post edited by lackofcheese on
  • GreyHugeGreyHuge
    edited September 2010
    No. Is that what this is about? Using somebody else's story just seems so... Unprofessional.
    You're making the same fallacy people make about anime and comics.

    EDIT: Does anyone know the name of that fallacy? I'd like to know so I can sound more erudite when talking about this sort of thing.
    Post edited by GreyHuge on
  • WalkerWalker
    No. Is that what this is about? Using somebody else's story just seems so... Unprofessional.
    Professionals do it all the time. Writing spec scripts for existing television shows is how a good number of screenwriters get their job.
  • theknoxinatortheknoxinator
    No. Is that what this is about? Using somebody else's story just seems so... Unprofessional.
    I also tend to feel that way about people who do fan fic stuff. It's certainly okay to take influences from wherever, but straight up using someone else's world seems like a cop out. Yet, I have found some situations where someone will write a sequel or spin off to something that is really good, just so long as they stay consistent to the world. I am not a fan of people who decide that they can write someone else's story better and rewrite the world to fit their own view, regardless of whether their view is more interesting or not.
  • Victor FrostVictor Frost
    edited September 2010
    It's certainly okay to take influences from wherever, but straight up using someone else's world seems like a cop out.
    I would argue that THIS Harry Potter universe is MUCH DIFFERENT.
    I am not a fan of people who decide that they can write someone else's story better and rewrite the world to fit their own view, regardless of whether their view is more interesting or not.
    So you've never told anyone "If you think you can do it better, go for it?"
    Post edited by Victor Frost on
  • theknoxinatortheknoxinator
    I would argue that THIS Harry Potter universe is MUCH DIFFERENT.
    If it's really that different, then why keep the same characters? Is it really so hard to make new ones that are based on the old ones?
    So you've never told anyone "If you think you can do it better, go for it?"
    Sure I have. But I also encourage them to be clever enough to make new characters, try a new setting, have different events. You want to do a story with magic in the real world? Fine. There are millions of ways to do that without using a kid with a scar on his head that goes to school with other magical kids and has a penchant for getting into trouble, yet somehow winning all the time.
  • WindUpBirdWindUpBird
    edited September 2010
    ...Have you tried reading the story in question?
    No. Is that what this is about? Using somebody else's story just seems so... Unprofessional.
    I would agree. It's the same reason Dark Knight Returns is uncreative, worthless bullshit. I mean, c'mon. Frank Miller is creative enough. He could have created his own world to tell that story. How unprofessional.

    In fact, same goes for Naoki Urasawa. Pluto is garbage. He should stop biting Tezuka's stuff and come up with a unique, groundbreaking story. Be professional.

    O WAIT
    Post edited by WindUpBird on
  • balderdashbalderdash
    If it's really that different, then why keep the same characters? Is it really so hard to make new ones that are based on the old ones?
    I believe that in this case the contrast between the new and original versions of the characters is intended to be instructive. The way you've framed the issue essentially dismisses the entire concept of variations on a theme.

    While it's certainly not the case for all or even most derivative creative works, in many cases similarities are used to make deliberate differences stand out. Extreme similarities - retelling the same story with the same characters, for example - may be profitably employed to highlight the importance of dissimilar elements which might seem insignificant or simply out of place in a work with no familiar context.
  • theknoxinatortheknoxinator
    The way you've framed the issue essentially dismisses the entire concept of variations on a theme.
    Setting and theme are not the same thing. You can retell a story hundreds of times and get across the same themes without reusing a setting. You don't have to go any further than Star Wars to prove that.
  • balderdashbalderdash
    Setting and theme are not the same thing. You can retell a story hundreds of times and get across the same themes without reusing a setting. You don't have to go any further than Star Wars to prove that.
    You're deliberately misunderstanding the word "theme" used in its musical sense as part of an analogy to be instead its literal literary counterpart. Punk.
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