GeekNights 20111129 - 100 Percent in Games

Apsup

Tonight on GeekNights, we consider what drives us and others to truly "100%" a game. On the way, we discuss humble bundles and how working at Zynga may not be the most fun job one could have.

Rym's Thing - Final Fail
Scott's Thing - The Walking Problem: Solved

http://frontrowcrew.com/geeknights/20111129/100-percent-in-games/

Rochelle

Rym's Thing - Final Fail

I cringed so much when I watched this.

George Patches

Man, I barely 10% most games. :P

Apsup

I think that last game I 100%ted, was Shadow Complex. Also I remember that I have 100% on both in Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow and in Dawn of Sorrow. Also I did all the achievements in the Assassin's Creed 2 and all the side quests I could find in the Red Dead Redemption.

The reason why I do all the extra stuff in some games is quite simple. I just love those games enough to keep playing them even after the story has ended. Or in some cases like in Just Cause 2 I try to avoid the story to focus on smaller stuff so the experience would last longer.

I still like to play Mega Man 2 time after time just because it's so good. The simple act of playing that game feels good for me and it doesn't matter that that game can't give me anything new anymore, I don't care.

And it's not like I don't have stuff to play, I think that even if I started to speedrun trough all my games there would still be enough to last me a long time. Some games just are so enjoyable that I want to spend time with them. because for me in games it's not about the destination, it's about the journey.

Rym's Thing - Final Fail

I cringed so much when I watched this.

I watched couple of minutes and stopped. I just don't enjoy seeing other people in pain, unless it's in hilarious conditions. Fails like that usually aren't.

InvaderREN

I guess it depends what game. Getting 100% in a Mario game is usually not too hard but getting 100% in something like TWEWY is friggin insane. And probably my single greatest gaming achievement.

Rochelle

I watched couple of minutes and stopped. I just don't enjoy seeing other people in pain, unless it's in hilarious conditions. Fails like that usually aren't.

My boyfriend and I were shouting and groaning at a lot of those head injuries. There were a few hilarious ones like the kid trying spring up the ground and he hits the underside of the table (4:43) and the last one of the kid running into the furniture gave us quite a good laugh.

Cremlian

Rym's Thing - Final Fail

I cringed so much when I watched this.

Yea, those videos to me service as warnings against off road biking and skate boarding mostly.

Matt

The reason you don't feel fulfilled by completing just the light world in Super Meat Boy is because the rest of the levels are AWESOME. Dark world, cotton alley, and even a lot of the DLC stages are really great.

These are not lame re-makes as Scott said, the difficulty is not inserted in a cheap manner. I feel that these extra stages are actually a case of inspired level design and I absolutely loved playing them. If you are playing Super Meat Boy for the plot, you're doing it wrong. Plow right through that ending video and keep on meating.

Apreche

No desire for more meat. Up until the end I was looking forward to each new level. As soon as I beat it, I suddenly felt dread at the thought of playing even one more level. Even know I consider playing a hell level, and I just don't want to.

Matt

To each their own I suppose. I hit the same exact wall that you and Rym described when I go to the point of beating every dark world level. A+ing them all would be incredibly hard so stopped playing.

This podcast brought back some thoughts I've been having on completing games and DLC. I have been resisting the march of expansive single-player titles that have been hitting over the past few years. The big single-player games I've played on my 360 where Mass Effect, Bioshock, and GTA IV, but then I crapped out. I think my mind just can't get around the DLC question.

I always have a desire to go for that 100%. I'm "all or nothing" to a fault, I'll admit it. The problem is that all of the bonus challenges and side quests that would be tucked away on a cartridge are now being sold as DLC. In addition, there are cash-grabs and worthless content also mixed into that pool of "should have been on the disc" content.

I really want to have the "full experience" of a game (whatever the hell that is supposed to mean), but I know once I beat it, I will be faced with this conundrum of 10 pieces of DLC, only some of which are part of that "full experience" and some of which are not worth it. Aside from the advice of friends who have played the games before me, I have no way of knowing where to draw the line.

Either crap DLC is going to ruin my experience, or that I am going to feel left unfulfilled if I just never even give the DLC a shot. That is holding me back from making a decision to play certain games. In the mean time, I'm having plenty of fun reading books, playing board games, etc. I just don't want video games to pass me too far by. Heck, I've been playing a lot of B-level Nintendo games just because I don't run into this.

Apreche

Yeah, I guess we neglected to mention the compulsive nature of many nerds. Many geeks of all kinds have some level of OCD. They just have to collect all the comics, all the Pokemons, all the M:TG cards, or whatever. It's a perspective we often miss on GeekNights because I used to have it very slightly and completely got rid of it many years ago. I don't think Rym ever had it in the time I've known him. But yeah, there are lots of people who just can't help themselves. Even if they are no longer having fun with a thing, they just stop themselves from collecting every single last bit of thing to be collected. MMOs are the worst for those people.

Neito

I'll only try to 100% a game if doing so is an interesting challenge, like in Mario World, or where doing so is effectively part of the game, like Monster Hunter. I can't understand the people who compulsively play all of each game like that, especially in games like Elder Scrolls/Fallout where some of the content is mutually exclusive.

Rym

It's a perspective we often miss on GeekNights because I used to have it very slightly and completely got rid of it many years ago. I don't think Rym ever had it in the time I've known him.

I luckily got it out of my system when I quit playing Magic. Prior to that, I had my X-Men cards (oh shit, it's Wolverine foils!), my Magic cards, etc... Had you known me when I was in middle school...

Anthony Heman

I never really try to hit the arbitrary 100% goals. I play as much as I enjoy something, and only pursue achievements that sound like they will enhance my experience in one way or another. It's interesting for me to look back at my Steam Profile.

The last game I almost "100%"ed was Bastion: http://steamcommunity.com/id/Creamsteak/stats/bastion/?tab=achievements

Somehow I didn't get credit for the first time I beat the game, but I did get credit for the second time. So I consider that 100%.

I had all I cared to get from Darksiders (minus the couple that I did but have bugged out).

http://steamcommunity.com/id/Creamsteak/stats/Darksiders/?tab=achievements

I had every Defense Grid achievement till they added DLC.

http://steamcommunity.com/id/Creamsteak/stats/DefenseGrid:Awakening/?tab=achievements

I had all but the "1000 multiplayer games as each race" achievements in Vanilla Dawn of War 2.

I also believe I had done everything there was to do in Valkyrie Profile and Final Fantasy 8. I actually still have the FF8 save file. I "guess" I've 100%'d Final Fantasy 1, but I never bothered to complete certain hard modes that have been invented.

Honestly it's surprising to think about, but I can name all kinds of little things I skipped in almost every game going all the way back.

I guess I've "100%"ed Zelda Quest 1 and A Link to the Past. I know I never bothered to find every single thing in quest 2, I havn't beaten "Link".

Apsup

Somehow I didn't get credit for the first time I beat the game, but I did get credit for the second time. So I consider that 100%.

Did you take different ending both playtimes, Bastion has different achievements for both of the ending.

Anthony Heman

Somehow I didn't get credit for the first time I beat the game, but I did get credit for the second time. So I consider that 100%.

Did you take different ending both playtimes, Bastion has different achievements for both of the ending.

If you look at the link, the achievement I didn't get is "The End" (complete the game) and the achievement I did get was "Calamity Kid" Complete the story in New Game Plus.

WindUpBird

Man, I have a hard enough time completing most of the games in my stack, let alone 100%-ing them. I do want to get 200% in SotN, though.

Apsup

Somehow I didn't get credit for the first time I beat the game, but I did get credit for the second time. So I consider that 100%.

Did you take different ending both playtimes, Bastion has different achievements for both of the ending.

If you look at the link, the achievement I didn't get is "The End" (complete the game) and the achievement I did get was "Calamity Kid" Complete the story in New Game Plus.

You also got The Beginning achievement that is the achievement for one of the endings. The End is for the other. I was confused too until I realized that.

ColombianShadow

I tend to 100% portable games much more than console ones, as waiting for the bus/train and then riding said bus/train gives me quite a bit of time. Getting every single giant coin in New Super Mario Bros. kept me busy when I used to ride the bus home for an hour and a half to and from my previous job. Went for all S ranks in Sonic Rush, got 100% in Castlevania: Dawn of Sorrow, beat arcade/survival modes with all characters in Street Fighter Alpha 3 MAX, got all my dudes to max level in Final Fantasy III DS.
Now I play games on my phone like Angry Birds and Cut the Rope, and I don't move forward unless I 100% each level.
No longer have the time to sit down at home and play the shit out of games, nowadays I play through the story and either move onto the next game or do something else life throws at me; although I'm attempting to go the 100% route with Batman: Arkham City.

Apreche

Angry Birds I beat every level, but fuck getting three golden eggs on every map.

gomidog

Yeah, I guess we neglected to mention the compulsive nature of many nerds. Many geeks of all kinds have some level of OCD. They just have to collect all the comics, all the Pokemons, all the M:TG cards, or whatever. It's a perspective we often miss on GeekNights because I used to have it very slightly and completely got rid of it many years ago. I don't think Rym ever had it in the time I've known him. But yeah, there are lots of people who just can't help themselves. Even if they are no longer having fun with a thing, they just stop themselves from collecting every single last bit of thing to be collected. MMOs are the worst for those people.

No, see, people have no idea what OCD is. If the collecting geek really had OCD, he would organize his comics into super neat little piles, because otherwise he was worried something terrible would happen. He would then have mental flashes of stabbing his hand with a pen, and then he would have a panic attack and have to go wash his hand to make the bad mental imagery go away.

TheWhaleShark

I can't understand the people who compulsively play all of each game like that, especially in games like Elder Scrolls/Fallout where some of the content is mutually exclusive.

That really bothers me in games. On the one hand, I understand the desire to create branching narratives, because it creates the illusion that your in-game choices actually have some impact. On the other hand, denying me the awesomest widget in the game because of some minor dialogue choice I made 65 hours of gameplay ago is fucking horseshit, especially when you have no way of knowing the outcome of the choice.

Things like that can be done well, but it takes a certain finesse to pull it off without coming off like a douche.

If you want to entice people to 100% your game, it's really best if the options remain even when you're near the very end.

EDIT: And yeah, you're talking about obsession, Scott, not OCD or compulsion.

OCD is when I yell at you for putting orange tape on that rack of samples because it's supposed to have yellow tape and you can't fucking mix up the colors because I said so.

HMTKSteve

I quit 100%ing games when Xbox fucked me out if a completion badge that I had already earned because the developer released some shitty DLC a year after the game released.

There us no way I will ever 100% Lego star wars complete collection because I don't care about blue minikits or playing super story.

If a chievo is easy I will replay to get it but I like to plan for these by using multiple save games.

theknoxinator

For me it really depends on the game, I only try to go for 100% on games that I really like. My playing habits have also changed over time, so I'm less likely to go for it today compared to years ago. Back in day I got 100% on each PS2 GTA game. I would never spend the time to do that now, which is why I completely ignored most of the side stuff in Red Faction: Guerilla (aka Space Asshole), even though I had a blast playing it. On the other hand, I did spend the time to get 100% in Assassin's Creed II, but it's not nearly the same kind of time commitment. Even with 100% it only took 35 hours to do so.

Another factor that plays into it is achievements/trophies. Yeah, I know that they don't mean shit in the real world, but I still see them as a sort of personal challenge. And again, it depends on the game. Most games that have them for difficulty, I won't bother if it's unreasonable to do so. Pretty much every game that has them for multiplayer, I won't bother since I don't do multiplayer (co-op is another story).

I don't remember exactly which game I got 100% on last was, probably was AC2. Next one will be Uncharted 3 though, once I finish the campaign one more time on Crushing.

ColombianShadow

Another factor that plays into it is achievements/trophies. Yeah, I know that they don't mean shit in the real world, but I still see them as a sort of personal challenge.

Does anyone else feel that Xbox 360 Achievements are better than Playstation Trophies? For some opdd reason, when I get an achievement and the message pops up, I think "Ooh that's nice," while getting the equivalent message in a Playstation game just makes me think "That's kind of lame."

Shiam

I can't understand the people who compulsively play all of each game like that, especially in games like Elder Scrolls/Fallout where some of the content is mutually exclusive.

That really bothers me in games. On the one hand, I understand the desire to create branching narratives, because it creates the illusion that your in-game choices actually have some impact. On the other hand, denying me the awesomest widget in the game because of some minor dialogue choice I made 65 hours of gameplay ago is fucking horseshit, especially when you have no way of knowing the outcome of the choice.

Honestly the only time I even noticed something like that was for one unique item in Fallout 3 which I realized well after the fact that was a minor quest reward and had to be stolen before the quest or gotten via the quest, and I didn't notice that until I went and looked up all the unique items. So yeah I don't see why that should bother you unless you are playing the game explicitly to 100% it. I feel like there's a bigger problem at hand if not getting some widget makes or breaks your game play experience.
Personally I almost never even try to 100% a game. In a open world game I will try to see all the things, or hit all the major points of the game. In a game like Fallout this means I tend to try to find most places and do most of the quests but it doesn't bother me if I miss something minor or not obvious. In more linear game I tend to try an poke all the obvious things, but I'm not going to replay the game or redo any significant chunk because I missed something. There are exceptions to that though if there's something particularly cool I missed I'll go back but it has to be well worth the effort.

open_sketchbook

Yo, Rym, I'll totally play you at Advance Wars at PAX East, if I can find one of my cartridges. I, too, have destroyed the advanced single player campaigns and alienated my friends from the multiplayer by stomping them to pieces.

Totally Guy

I think the last time I 100%ed a game was Yoshi's Island on the SNES. And then again on the GBA.

Luke Burrage

I don't have time to do this now, but back in university I 100%ed a few N64 games.

Golden Eye (every level on every difficulty to unlock all the extras)
Mario 64 (every star)
Zelda 64 (had to look up some stuff to get everything on this)

I've completed a few games on the NES, but for those "getting to the end" was a completion in itself. Ninja Gaiden was balls hard, so I'm most proud of that.

KapitänTim

Zelda 64? Ocarina or Mask?

Greg

My biggest gaming shame is that -- despite how much I've played it -- I've never actually gotten any Chaos Emeralds in Sonic Advanced. It's something I've wanted to do since I beat it with all 4 characters, but I'm not boss enough to do.