Go - The Ancient Oriental Game of Strategy

VentureJ

I understand that I am incredibly new to this forum as a whole, and I am not quite familiar with the sub-culture that resides here. Regardless of that, there is one fact that I do know: you love board games. Of course, your main preferences are mostly German-styled board games, but I'm sure Oriental style board games are somewhat familiar to you. What I am bringing up is a discussion about the Oriental strategy game, Go.

As made famous by the popular Shonen Jump manga, Hikaru No Go, this game is considered to be one of the oldest unchanged board game to date. As a matter of fact, Go has been considered to be better and deeper than CHESS.

What are all your individual thoughts on this game? Do you know what it is? Do you play it? Do you have a mind to learn of its existence?

Kiey

I picked up Go after watching Hikaru no Go. I really enjoy the game, it's that great mix of simple rules and complex strategy. I haven't had a chance to play against other people, but I have found it fun to play against myself when I have some time to kill. I try and play quickly to prevent from maybe picking one side over the other, and thus sabotaging myself.

VentureJ

How do you go about playing by yourself? I can never really imagine myself doing so, since knowing how both of the players will move kills the strategic elements of the game.

Kiey

Well like I was saying I try to play quick, and sorta instinctive rather then planning out strategies just sorta making it up as I go kinda thing.

VentureJ

Interesting idea. Go is a game that really does rely heavily on instincts and psynergy, so speed-running through a game seems to be a viable training method. How interesting.

What is your rank? How skilled are you, Kiey?

Apreche

I know how to play Go. I played it a very small number of times. I understand the depth and the basic strategy of the game. I also understand how it has a hojillion permutations and how not even a supercomputer can play it well. Given that, I just don't find the game that fun. The amount of time and effort required to build enough skill to play a decent game is not something I have. The point of a game is to have fun, and Go seems to be designed for everything but fun. Tigris and Euphrates is deep enough for me. It also allows for more than two players and goes over nicely at parties. It also has pretty colors.

VentureJ

I admit, compared to many of the more active German board games, Go is quieter and possibly more thought-provoking. It really isn't a party game, and it can get quite stressful. Still, in more higher-level games, the intensity of the plays can get quite exhilirating.

And you're right, Go takes a lot of time to fully grasp.

Kiey

Go, like Chess, is a game where the fun is in coming up with a strategy against an ever changing opponent.

And I have no idea what my rank is... or how one would go about measuring that.

Brineshrimp

I need to go to a local board game convention. I enjoy board/card games/RPGs more than a lot of other stuff that I do. None of my friends that I see all the time enjoy it as much as I do (

Sail

I've been playing Panda glGO on and off for about a year. There are tons of cool people from all around the world who are all willing to give pointers. It's a great place to learn.

VentureJ

I enjoy those internet Go games, although it really can't beat playing against someone face-to-face. Being able to observe the opponent's body-language is one aspect of the game that isn't included in the internet versions of the game.

Symmetry

I play at Yahoo games sometimes under the name SymmetricPuppies (whaaat?), usually on a small 9x9 board. I've played about 250 games total and its quite a bit of fun now.

VentureJ

I play at Yahoo games sometimes under the name SymmetricPuppies (whaaat?), usually on a small 9x9 board. I've played about 250 games total and its quite a bit of fun now.

So you're saying that it used to not be fun? I can understand this, but is that what you are saying?

Symmetry

I'm saying it used to be sort of fun and now its definitely fun.

Rym

RIT had a fairly large and very active Go club on campus. We (RIT Anime) often worked with them to coordinate events, though I never had the time to play with them.

VentureJ

RIT had a fairly large and very active Go club on campus. We (RIT Anime) often worked with them to coordinate events, though I never had the time to play with them.

That's a pity. Everyone should try Go at least once, especially you Rym.

Rym

Oh, I tried it and liked it. I just didn't have time to play on any regular basis.

Kiey

Someone could set up a Geek Nights Go league, and everyone could play against each other online in a round robin fashion... that'd be cool.

VentureJ

Someone could set up a Geek Nights Go league, and everyone could play against each other online in a round robin fashion... that'd be cool.

I agree, that would be quite awesome. Of course, this all depends on the level of interest in Go within this community.

VentureJ

Now that Scrym's interest in Go has been sparked, I believe it is time to revive this thread.

If any of you guys have any questions regarding this game, feel free to ask me. I have quite a bit of experience teaching this game to beginners/intermediates.

Apreche

Now that Scrym's interest in Go has been sparked, I believe it is time to revive this thread.

If any of you guys have any questions regarding this game, feel free to ask me. I have quite a bit of experience teaching this game to beginners/intermediates.

Can you point us to some rules, not strategy just the rules, of the game that are written in freaking English. I'm not interested in learning all these terms like ko, and atari. I just want to know the rules of the game written in plain English without any ambiguities. The rules that came with our set and the rules on Wikipedia were demolished by our rules-lawyerish nature.

VentureJ

Here's a good compilation of the Go Lessons after each Hikaru no Go episode. It's kinda cheesy, but it teaches your practically everything. It starts off incredibly basic, but it'll get a bit more advanced in the end. It's 8 minutes, so it isn't too long, and it shows you everything you need to know.

Unfortunately, those terms are essential to your learning, but they are actually fairly simple concepts that are explained quite well in the video. Plus, there aren't that many of them anyway. Though I'm curious, which Go board did you get?

This is also a good website to visit for fairly simple go lessons: The Interactive Way to Go

Apreche

Though I'm curious, which Go board did you get?

We got a cheap and practical one with built-in drawers to hold the pieces. I know Go people love those really tall wooden blocks with the bowls of stones that are all fancy. For us it is the game itself that matters, and the game is the same even if you play it with some graph paper and some pencils.

VentureJ

Oh mans, your board is a lot more hardcore than mine. Mine is pretty much just a flat board with pieces that come in ziploc bags.

How helpful was the video/website?

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How helpful was the video/website?

Awesome! I can do the 40 Kyu problems... ._.;;

VentureJ

At my peak, I was capable of completing 12 Kyu problems. I don't know how good I am now, though I'm sure I can still hold my own.

Also, 9x9 games are incredibly tactical and can be fun for a quick game.

Apreche

I am stuck on the second 37 Kyu problem. Anyway, I think the rules are clear now. Rym and I played a 6x6 game, and I don't think we screwed anything up. Regardless, it wasn't that much fun. Not as bad as before, but not some amazing experience. We'll definitely try a few more times at least.

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Come on Scott. *finished the tutorial* It'll get worse in Death or Alive x-X DAMNED SECOND PUZZLE!

And I think 6x6 is a tad too small, I mean there must be empty squares left as territory.

VentureJ

Hmm...wow. Doing that problem comes naturally to me, so I'm sure that comes over time.

Anyway, if you look at it, you're 3 stone structure is about to get completely annihilated, so your best first move would be to place a black stone on E2. This move would allow you to potentially capture the stone at E3, switching you from a defensive position to an offensive position.

Go ahead and start with that.

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Anyway, it isn't good to play on a 6x6 board unless you are a complete noob to thinking strategically. It's best to start off with a 9x9 board to practice basic tactics. You should then move on to a 13x13 board which would introduce the idea of investment of territory. Once you feel comfortable with that, go ahead and move on to a 19x19 board, which allows for a helluva lot of strategies and neat tricks.

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Yeah, tried the problem again, failed a few times and then found the solution again, I was skipping one step (the one SniperDragon mentions).
Anyways, SniperDragon, do you have a bunch of general tips on how one should tackle various problems. i.e. what first to do, then what, then what, then etc...

VentureJ

Well, I was thinking of making a YouTube series that teaches basic and intermediate principles of Go, problem walkthroughs, etc. I've taught the game at numerous clubs and organizations, so it'd be fun to do so.

Do you think it's a good idea?