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The Microsoft Surface cannot be inovative
Ok, you want to clutter the forums,
"You argue that Microsoft sucks and you use MSN and hotmail! Congratulations on defeating yourself."
Funnily enough I like Microsoft, they just seem incapable right now of doing anything new.
I still stand by my conclusion based on what Microsoft has been doing up until this point and shows no sign of changing.
The "Surface" cannot and will not be a cool and innovative product. If it is I will stand corrected and will give £10 to the GeekNights fund or anyone who is willing to pledge the same amount in opposition (this excludes Rym and Scott).
I am not afraid to be embarrassed and wouldn't mind being proved wrong. I want this to be as cool as it can but feel Microsoft is incapable of doing so. I also believe you are incapable of formulating a solid argument to oppose me as you have resorted to simply picking at mine.
The reason for wanting to move out of this thread is to not block it up for the people thinking of cool ideas (which will not come to pass). I am somewhat new here and was unsure whether starting a new thread in flamewars would be a better idea.
I created this new thread to free up the other one for discussion of the product itself.
"You argue that Microsoft sucks and you use MSN and hotmail! Congratulations on defeating yourself."
Funnily enough I like Microsoft, they just seem incapable right now of doing anything new.
I still stand by my conclusion based on what Microsoft has been doing up until this point and shows no sign of changing.
The "Surface" cannot and will not be a cool and innovative product. If it is I will stand corrected and will give £10 to the GeekNights fund or anyone who is willing to pledge the same amount in opposition (this excludes Rym and Scott).
I am not afraid to be embarrassed and wouldn't mind being proved wrong. I want this to be as cool as it can but feel Microsoft is incapable of doing so. I also believe you are incapable of formulating a solid argument to oppose me as you have resorted to simply picking at mine.
The reason for wanting to move out of this thread is to not block it up for the people thinking of cool ideas (which will not come to pass). I am somewhat new here and was unsure whether starting a new thread in flamewars would be a better idea.
I created this new thread to free up the other one for discussion of the product itself.
Comments
Oh, and I'm going to assume you surrendered since you dodged my last question.
I make bullshit asumptions do I? Then please tell me what is a "solid" argument or better still, give me an example.
Stop nit picking and just try and prove me plausibly wrong.
Burden of proof aside, you would never ask an opponent to come up with your argument for you in a court of law, would you? I feel that has been done quite enough already.
Well, I believe Microsoft's design IS innovative. Simply because it's using a whole new idea in software. Instead of following the basic touch pad idea, it's using a new system. How can it not be innovative if the whole idea is new?
Idea: Playing games, Voice chat, Cooperative play, Emulators, The buying of content via a computer, etc.. have already been done in other places
Additional Argument: Microsoft's aim is to make money and innovation usually requires risk. Its current business practices are extremely risk averse (as are many other companies but we are focusing primarily on Microsoft) and not innovating would be in their best interests.
Premise: Microsoft is taking innovations that have already proven popular and presented them to the public as a whole.
Inference: there is no feature, or combination of features used together that had not been done before featured in the XBOX360 or any Microsoft product (in recent years) [or in the "Surface"].
Conclusion: This is not innovation, it is merely repackaging which is not innovation.
To expand upon this point. Do you see anything in the videos for the surface which suggests innovation?
I really like this way of arguing.
- If the Conditions are Met, Are you Donating the Equivalent to Ten Pounds in American currency, or Ten Dollars US?
- Are you willing to Provide Proof of Transaction?
- Will there be a third party to Ensure fairness in deciding who wins? Will it be a group consensus? Will you be deciding yourself?
It's a new system. So it's innovative. If you want to get technical, it's innovative whether you like it or not...
Surface is innovative because it integrates human-object interaction into computing (i.e placing a credit card down and then paying for your bill instantly). Apart from that, you butchered logical arguments on a whole anyways.
If you wanna throw the PC into the mix, same thing. All those things have yet to be integrated together smoothly into one program. You have to take risks in business, sometimes they fail. That is no mistake, that is good business. I have already addressed the X-box. Regarding the Surface, yes, they are using SOME proven popular ideas. But none of those ideas have been yet introduced to a consumer market, and nor have any of them demonstrated credit card reading and object recognition. These two are extremely innovative. A customer choosing between two cell phones places them both on the Surface. The specifications and features immediately pop up and they can be compared side my side... Bill Gates demonstrates how food in a restaurant can be paid for between two credit cards placed haphazardly on the Surface and shows two unique ways that the tab can be automatically split... A digital camera is placed on the Surface and automatically downloads the photos that can then be worked with...
I will give £10 sterling to GeekNights and will expect the equivalent in US dollars to be returned so as GeekNights will not be effected by changes in exchange rates. This is currently stands at around $19.8
If GeekNights is willing to act as an intermediary I would also ask for one clause to be added:
Anyone wishing to challenge me must pay £10 sterling to GeekNights should I (or someone else) be able to find the same or similar functionality in some other product.
This applies only if you can afford it, as to not alienate those with no income.
Not innovation, I believe I could have achieved the same effect with a pc long before then.
Object recognition is already done in the areas of bluetooth, Also, there are many innovations that never reach the consumer market. As before I say that already setting up something I could do with effort and people were already doing is not an innovation.
Risks in businesses are a good thing but Microsoft just isn't in the mood to take them. The Zune could have had lots of cool abilities that could for you have classed as innovations but even though they had been done before were not included (however, the Zune was a hurried product. if anyone thinks that is an assumption I can dig out the windows weekly review with the head of the Zune team)
And yes If you are going to argue with me for money I do not expect to be giving in for nothing. Also I think the GeekNights people deserve some money for what they do and levering other people seems a whole lot easier than footing the whole bill myself.
Yeah, its actually kinda fun. but really they are incapable of just presenting me with an argument to prove wrong and accepting it.
I am just saying that without a shadow of a doubt that when the surface comes out it wont do anything innovative. Microsoft is and will be incapable of innovation until they change as a business. I expect this to come in the lead up to the next version of windows due to a lot of reshuffling but for now there will not be any innovation.
And I don't see why the business has to change for it to become innovative. Innovation depends on the products made, not the business itself.
Microsoft's current attitude to innovation is to do what it has with the XBOX360 and integrate other popular features.
and as a trump card:
Not even Google can find any pages stating a feature that directly links XBOX360 to any innovation.
the best I could find were the blades which are just fancy tabs.
People were using teamspeak, people were using IM, people were downloading games. I still wait for the defining feature you see as innovation.
"Objects like drinking glasses, credit cards, and digital cameras? Uh, yeah, I don't think so. "
Firstly, RFID but secondly how is selecting a meal with a computer an innovation?
Sail, calm down and stop trolling. Come up with an innovative feature you see on the surface and defend it as inovative.
Also, in XBOX360, what is the one thing you can pick out as innovative?
I am still waiting for that one feature. Just one.
"innovative - being or producing something like nothing done or experienced or created before
It's a new system. So it's innovative. If you want to get technical, it's innovative whether you like it or not..."
A.
"People were experiencing all the features of xbox and xbox live and just about every other Microsoft product before they were produced by Microsoft."
Still waiting
I've got things to do right now. You are wasting my time.
I honestly consider the surface as being a product with huge potential for innovation (though most likely by third parties) and think the way the XBOX360 puts everything together is incredibly innovative
and I still think I won this argument as you failed to satisfy any of my requests at which time I would have pulled out and admitted defeat. I still believe your stance to be basically incorrect as the combining or already available and used features into a pre made box doesn't account to innovation.