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TF2: Payload and the medic updates

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  • Fun joke though. I think I'm going to start playing UT1 again.
  • The difference is that Omnutia and Scott are getting their fun from difference sources.
    Scott wants a game that's going to push him to higher challenges.
    Omnutia wants a game where you can kinda just goof around with a bunch of people.
  • edited May 2008
    But Omnutia resents Scott's sentiment that simply getting enjoyment from a game is not a games purpose.
    Post edited by Omnutia on
  • But Omnutia resents Scott's sentiment that simply getting enjoyment from a game is not a games purpose.
    That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that the source of enjoyment is important. If you're going to get enjoyment from a game, at least play a game that exercises a mental or physical muscle to some capacity. If you're going to waste time, at least pick something that is at least a tiny bit productive and useful instead of something that is 100% a complete waste.
  • edited May 2008
    Well, Scott, I know you say Tribes 2 needs at least 40 people to be fun but you have a podcast that goes out to thousands of geeks. Surely if you put out a call they will come.
    Post edited by Omnutia on
  • Well, Scott, I know you say Tribes 2 needs at least 40 people to be fun but you have a podcast that goes out to thousands of geeks. Surely if you put out a call they will come.
    It's an issue of technology, not people.
  • Back to the topic.
    The actual problem with the medic update is several things. First it encourages achievement seeking, which while in itself would be fine, frustrates players who want to play the game normally as several of the achievements are almost impossible to get passively. Another problem this poses is that it gives a tactical advantage to people who do this; while the new weapons aren't "better" they are useful, otherwise no one would use them. Finally the fact that these only exist for the medic results in way more medics than needed most of the time, where before you would only have 1-2 per team.
    As for the new map type, I was pleasantly surprised by it. It creates a little more diversity in strategy, and is significantly better designed than many other maps, though it does still suffer from points where things get stagnant. Currently the biggest problem with the map is that many people still don't really get how to play it.
    I probably have a very different view of TF2 than most though, I primarily play on LAN with several friends. When I do play online, I find about 60% of servers are not very fun, especially the symmetric maps, which are almost always deadlocked or one team crushing the other repeatedly. If Valve wishes to include unlockable content, it should serve the purpose of entertaining people who enjoy collecting things, and otherwise have a marginal effect on the game, alternate skins or models would be a good option.
  • edited May 2008
    You don't know shit.
    Here's the shit I know. I know that I have played TF2 in the past. I know that TF2 had an extremely low skill cap. The models and hitboxes are huge. The characters are slow. The aim is inaccurate. Most weapons do not require aiming. Even with an organized map, the optimium strategies to attain victory were obvious and trivial to achieve with any amount of team coordination.

    I know what has been changed. They have given one class in the game additional weapons options. These options are only available to players who play the game not to win, but to achieve certain other goals, to get achievements. Thus, there is an advantage give to players not based on their reaction times, speed, aiming skill, etc. but based on the amount of time and dedication they have poured into the game.

    Whether the additional tactical options are balanced or not doesn't matter. If they aren't balanced, they ruin the game for obvious reasons. Even if they are balanced, they are still additional options, and additional options are always an advantage unless they are identical to existing options. If they are not identical to existing options, then they are an advantage. If they are identical, then they aren't really additional options, are they?

    I know what the game was like before the changes. I know what the changes were. The changes do not fix any of the problems the game had originally. They introduce new problems. It's simple deduction that the game still has an incredibly low skill cap compared the fpses of yore such as Tribes 2 and Quake 2. A low skill cap means that while there is skill involved in the game, it doesn't take a large amount of skill to achieve optimum gameplay. In other words, even though someone like Fatality will kick my ass at Quake, in TF2 we will be evenly matched. Even though he is more skilled than I am, we both have enough skill to play the game as best it can be played. Some other factor besides raw fps skill will determine victory.

    If you still think I need to play the game to attain some secret knowledge, let me ask you this. What will I learn by playing the game that I don't already know?
    I'm with you on this one Scott,the game really does have an extremely low skill cap.I've played games like UT2004 where it's a lot harder to play because the players don't move slowly and the aim isn't so glitchy.At first whe I played it I thought theere was a problem with my mosue but then I found out that the aim was supposed to be this slow.I even cranked up my sentsitivity but it still wasn't fast enough.
    Post edited by Necro on
  • I'm with you on this one Scott,the game really does have an extremely low skill cap.I've play games like UT2004 where it's a lot harder to play because the players don't move slowly and the aim isn't so glitchy.At first whe I played it I thought theere was a problem with my mosue but then I found out that the aim was supposed to be this slow.I even cranked up my sentsitivity but it still wasn't fast enough.
    UT is also an incredibly easy game. I remember the first time I played UT was back in the Counter-Strike days. I joined a server, my first time playing, and killed everybody without getting hit. LIterally. However, I couldn't win because I didn't know the button to push to pick up and drop the flag.
  • UT is also an incredibly easy game.
    I really don't care. You go on and on about how you have to play the game that requires the most skill but it's not all that useful so why do you care so much?
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