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GeekNights 20101129 - The Technology of Wikileaks

MrPeriodMrPeriod
edited November 2010 in GeekNights

Tonight, after talking a bit about the perils of "Enterprise" software, nevermind Microsoft flopping a bit on Kinect and Windows phone "hacking" and yet another problem presented by the United States' aging infrastructure, we consider the technological concerns of Wikileaks in the wake of the recent diplomatic wire reveal.

We also announce the next GeekNights Book Club selection of Michio Kaku's Hyperspace.

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  • NeitoNeito
    We also announce the next GeekNights Book Club selection ofMichio Kaku's Hyperspace
    Finally, a book I own!
  • Victor FrostVictor Frost
    We also announce the next GeekNights Book Club selection ofMichio Kaku's Hyperspace
    Finally, a book I own!
    And it's available on kindle too! *1-click-buy*
  • George PatchesGeorge Patches
    and yet anotherproblem presented by the United States' aging infrastructure,
    HA HAHAHA. You really can't get too mad at the power companies for not being able to handle double their current capacity. I like this though, because it really highlights the shear quantity of energy that it takes to move around as much as the average american does. Technology is not going to solve this problem in the short term, we really just need to drive less.
  • GeoGeo
    We also announce the next GeekNights Book Club selection ofMichio Kaku's Hyperspace
    Finally, a book I own!
    And it's available on kindle too! *1-click-buy*
  • PeguPegu
    edited November 2010
    I saw this earlier and am thinking of showing it to my math teacher. He is fairly computer literate. (Uses a python program he made to randomize our seating plan) I'm interested to see his response.
    Post edited by Pegu on
  • Jack DraigoJack Draigo
    Popular Science talked about the problem with everyone getting pure electric cars in an article, and it mentioned some cars that can put energy back into the grid, or be used as a backup generator in case the grid goes down. My best idea? Government program to put solar panels on everyone's homes, at least enough to power a washing machine/dryer or an electric car.
  • zehaevazehaeva
    My best idea? Government program to put solar panels on everyone's homes, at least enough to power a washing machine/dryer or an electric car.
    There already are government programs to help subsidize the cost of putting solar cells on homes.

    The larger issue would be how do you play on paying for this when half of the government wish to do nothing but cut taxes (which decreases the amount of money the government has to fund these projects), close the deficit (does the same) and pay down the debt (more of the same!).
  • RymRym
    Solar panels also aren't viable in many places, don't generate as much power as you'd hope, require maintenance, and aren't easily integrated with the grid.
  • George PatchesGeorge Patches
    edited December 2010
    don't generate as much power as you'd hope
    Yeah, they're pretty pitiful actually. I did the math once and figured I'd have to cover our roof entirely to generate even a quarter of the electricity we were using. It was a big house, but it was also a big ass roof.
    aren't easily integrated with the grid.
    A lot of people don't understand the problems of DC versus AC. The safety issues of servicing an electrical storage system are scary.
    Post edited by George Patches on
  • TheWhaleSharkTheWhaleShark
    and aren't easily integrated with the grid.
    Inverters are relatively cheap, actually. I've priced it out before. The primary problem is that affordable solar cells are horribly inefficient, and more efficient solar cells are so hideously expensive that it'll take 40 years to recoup your investment.

    For the time being, nuclear plants and wind power are the way to go.
  • RymRym
    Inverters are relatively cheap, actually.
    You need more than just an inverter to integrate with the grid.
  • Jack DraigoJack Draigo
    My thought for my own home was an array big enough to just power the AC in the summer. Help cut electricity bills and all that.
  • RymRym
    My thought for my own home was an array big enough to just power the AC in the summer.
    That's a difficult and ambitious project. Also bear in mind the AC is extremely load intensive.
  • gomidoggomidog
    Wind Power farms are beautiful. I don't understand people who hate them. I went to the one by my house on a foggy day, and I thought it was one of the prettiest things.

    We need as many solutions as possible, but I think nuclear supplemented as much as possible with hydro, wind, tidal, and solar is a good way to go.
  • Victor FrostVictor Frost
    Wind Power farms are beautiful. I don't understand people who hate them. I went to the one by my house on a foggy day, and I thought it was one of the prettiest things.
    During our drive to California, we passed by miles and miles of windfarms and it was just stunning.
  • Jack DraigoJack Draigo

    We need as many solutions as possible, but I think nuclear supplemented as much as possible with hydro, wind, tidal, and solar is a good way to go.
    This, except screw all those lesser forms of energy. Nuclear power is the Awesome that shall power us through the future!
  • RymRym
    We need as many solutions as possible, but I think nuclear supplemented as much as possible with hydro, wind, tidal, and solar is a good way to go.
    Definitely. For example, solar is terrible for base load, but its output maximizes when the weather tends to be the hottest and HVAC is driving the demand.

    Centralized solar stations can mitigate peak load in the summer fairly well.

    There's also the interesting option of small self-contained nuclear power plants for very rural areas. Removing long-distance transmission lines to some small communities and replacing them with a local nuclear generator could have a substantial net benefit.
  • RymRym
    This, except screw all those lesser forms of energy. Nuclear power is the Awesome that shall power us through the future!
    Nuclear power is a fantastic base load provider, but it doesn't scale well (up or down) with fluctuating load (unless we rebuild our entire transmission infrastructure to accommodate intelligent power routing).

    Wind and Solar do very well to handle transient load, as do quick-start natural gas generators.

    Hydroelectric is also extremely efficient for base load, though has the problem of being already mostly tapped out.
  • George PatchesGeorge Patches
    Wind Power farms are beautiful. I don't understand people who hate them. I went to the one by my house on a foggy day, and I thought it was one of the prettiest things.
    People hate change and don't have the admiration of modern engineering that many of us on this forum have.
  • gomidoggomidog
    This, except screw all those lesser forms of energy. Nuclear power is the Awesome that shall power us through the future!
    Except that the rarity of fissionable material means that if we don't ration our consumption of Uranium, we will run out within a few centuries. Don't be dumb. I'm not saying this just because it is "green," you know.
  • Jack DraigoJack Draigo

    There's also the interesting option of small self-contained nuclear power plants for very rural areas. Removing long-distance transmission lines to some small communities and replacing them with a local nuclear generator could have a substantial net benefit.
    One thing though is education: a lot of people in the US are very against nuclear power, much more so in rural areas.
    This, except screw all those lesser forms of energy. Nuclear power is the Awesome that shall power us through the future!
    Nuclear power is a fantastic base load provider, but it doesn't scale well (upordown) with fluctuating load (unless we rebuild our entire transmission infrastructure to accommodate intelligent power routing).

    Wind and Solar do very well to handle transient load, as do quick-start natural gas generators.

    Hydroelectric is also extremely efficient for base load, though has the problem of being already mostly tapped out.
    As you guys mentioned, we really should upgrade the infrastructure anyway. The only reason we don't is pork, useless politicians, and stupid voters.
  • OmnutiaOmnutia
    I'm a big farm of wind fans [Edit: Yeah, you'd better believe it.], or anything futuristic looking. I also find cooling towers to be very calming for some reason.

    I'm adding nuclear power plant to the list of things to have when we construct Nerdtopia, that and hydrophonic vegtable gardens.. and subterainian geofaces.
  • RymRym
    People hate change and don't have the admiration of modern engineering that many of us on this forum have.
    As I often point out, Parisians who already existed hated the Eiffel tower after its construction. As they died out, the next generation was indifferent, and the one after that saw it as a national icon. Such is the way with all things.
  • AprecheApreche
    People hate change and don't have the admiration of modern engineering that many of us on this forum have.
    As I often point out, Parisians who already existed hated the Eiffel tower after its construction. As they died out, the next generation was indifferent, and the one after that saw it as a national icon. Such is the way with all things.
    Boston Citgo sign.
  • RymRym
    Boston Citgo sign.
    RIT Sentinel.
  • AprecheApreche
    Boston Citgo sign.
    RIT Sentinel.
    Penn Station

    Oh wait...
  • ChurbaChurba
    Except that the rarity of fissionable material means that if we don't ration our consumption of Uranium, we will run out within a few centuries. Don't be dumb. I'm not saying this just because it is "green," you know.
    Thorium breeder reactors - we've got enough fuel to run those for a few thousand years.
  • NeitoNeito
    Boston Citgo sign.
    Semi-unrelated anticdote: They recently replaced the long-standing neon tubes with LEDs so they didn't have to crawl all over the Coop (the Kenmore Square Barns and Noble) to replace the bulbs every few months. You would not believe the bitching that occurred.
  • OmnutiaOmnutia
    Hypothetically, would moving to a city near a nuclear power station be worth it, just to live somewhere devoid of people who don't want to live near nuclear power stations?
  • TheWhaleSharkTheWhaleShark
    You need more than just an inverter to integrate with the grid.
    Sure, some cables and a disconnect. Grid-interfacing inverters can be had for around $2,000 - $3,000. The necessary components are a couple of hundred bucks extra. The solar cells are by far the most expensive part of a solar package.
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