I've always wondered about the bodega thing. Even living an hour outside of NYC my entire life, I'd never heard anyone use the term until I started going to the city regularly and talking to people who actually live there. We just called them crappy convenience stores (sometimes in an endearing way, sometimes just plain crappy).
Do they have to be spanish-run stores to be bodegas? Our off-brand or no-brand convenience stores were always run by angry old white dudes or Indian people.
Do they have to be spanish-run stores to be bodegas? Our off-brand or no-brand convenience stores were always run by angry old white dudes or Indian people.
It varies man - the two bodegas near me in Manhattan are owned and run by Koreans.
I had never even heard the word "bodega" until I visited the city.
I think the word bodega is used almost exclusively by NYCers, though. We have such places in LA but I've only ever heard the word bodega being used in reference to them by people who have lived in NYC.
Yeah. That's not how it is in the Pacific NW. It's just referred to as convenience store or mini mart. Most are ran by Asians. Some refer to them by the racist term, "gook marts".
Most Hispanic ran convenience stores are mainly for Spanish speaking and have "mercado" in the name.
I also have never heard the term bodega until ScRym mentioned it.
I've always wondered about the bodega thing. Even living an hour outside of NYC my entire life, I'd never heard anyone use the term until I started going to the city regularly and talking to people who actually live there. We just called them crappy convenience stores (sometimes in an endearing way, sometimes just plain crappy).
Do they have to be spanish-run stores to be bodegas? Our off-brand or no-brand convenience stores were always run by angry old white dudes or Indian people.
Yeah. That's not how it is in the Pacific NW. It's just referred to as convenience store or mini mart. Most are ran by Asians. Some refer to them by the racist term, "gook marts".
Most Hispanic ran convenience stores are mainly for Spanish speaking and have "mercado" in the name.
I also have never heard the term bodega until ScRym mentioned it.
Gook marts? WOW. Thankfully a term I have never heard. I'm a white man who grew up in a 98% Hispanic area and never learned Spanish beyond a surface level. That said, we call them Liquor Stores most of the time with an occasional Convenience store. Also, some people use 7-11 as a general term but that's silly, IMO.
New York has a deep set of jargon, probably moreso than any other city in the US, due simply to the unique structures and situations its residents find themselves interacting with on a daily basis.
A "bodega" is distinct from other types of similar stores. "Hobo" means something very specific here.
The subway has a whole lexicon and mythology of its own.
Out of curiosity, what does "hobo" specifically mean in NYC?
I'm familiar with two definitions for the word "hobo." One, which I think is the more modern one, is another word for "bum" -- i.e. your standard homeless, possibly alcoholic/drug addicted/mentally ill or any combination of the three person with poor hygiene. The other is the more old-fashioned term, which is a basically a homeless vagrant who'd travel from town to town trying to scrounge up work and meals, often by stowing away on cargo trains and such. You know, those old-timey pictures of guys with stubble and bindle sticks over their shoulders carrying their stuff.
I assume the NYC "hobo" is none of the above or perhaps a special case of "bum."
Hobo: 1. likely homeless 2. exhibiting a horrible stench 3. underground (or in a subway car)
Bum 1. likely homeless 2. panhandling or otherwise harassing people 3. above ground (not in a subway car)
I have different, less commonly used words or descriptions for other types of people, but I use these two words pretty consistently.
Confusingly, "bumfog" is the term for the smell of a hobo that lingers even when they have moved on. I personally refer to it sometimes as "Eau de Hobo."
We always use "bumfog" to describe the horrid stench cloud formed when the weather extends the effective range of hobo smelliness. Case in point: Penn Station in the heat of summer. A few hobos sprinkled around the terminal in that hot, humid air and you'll feel like you're in a gas chamber.
Reminds me of that little window you can open on most of the trains to let the air flow... If you've seen it open, it's either because there was bumfog or because it was too steamy-hot in there.
Gamer and con funk is pungent and highly unpleasant. If you meet one of these subway hobos who hasn't showered in years, you will literally not be able to breathe.
Even if caused by irrationality, it's still deliberate self inflicted behavior. The tragedy itself is not the stench but that it's underlying cause is likely avoidable.
Even if caused by irrationality, it's still deliberate self inflicted behavior. The tragedy itself is not the stench but that it's underlying cause is likely avoidable.
One could argue that it's not deliberate. Being "deliberate" requires some degree of agency, which these people clearly lack in a fashion.
I think about 99% of those cases of that kind of stench are not deliberate. They are not making a choice. Those folks are mentally ill and untreated, perhaps untreatable. It's just sad circumstances.
I used to help with this free showers thing in the Bowery, and getting some of those people through the system was balls hard. We'd get somebody a private shower and a new set of clothes. We did it one day a week. It was men only. At the same time we'd have a lottery system for a place to stay for a week. In short - I'd never exercised my gag reflex so frequently in all my life.
There's just not a catch-all for this problem and probably never will be.
We invest in a health care system that has the resources to intervene individually in these peoples' lives and follow through to a positive, or at least neutral, outcome.
I agree to a point. Intervention may be able to prevent someone from reaching those kinds of depth, but I do think that once someone crosses a sort of event horizon, they are just too far gone to come back and be a reasonable member of society.
I've had family members slip into "hobodom" and vanish. It's not pretty but I think it is, to a very large extent, preventable.
I do think that once someone crosses a sort of event horizon, they are just too far gone to come back and be a reasonable member of society.
That's where incarceration and treatment is necessary. If someone cannot be brought to a point where they have agency, then it's better to forcibly ensure they are safe and as healthy as possible.
That's where incarceration and treatment is necessary. If someone cannot be brought to a point where they have agency, then it's better to forcibly ensure they are safe and as healthy as possible.
Unfortunately, there are way too many people who think that the mentally ill homeless are just "lazy bums" who don't deserve any sort of treatment.
That really wouldn't be as bad as you make it sound - I mean, the upshot of the closing of most asylums was that a great many disabled people who don't have the ability to care for themselves found themselves without support and eventually on the streets.
Comments
I had never even heard the word "bodega" until I visited the city.
What brought me in to full enlightenment on the word was when the gracious Scrym and Emily allowed me to chill with them in Seattle during PAX.
Most Hispanic ran convenience stores are mainly for Spanish speaking and have "mercado" in the name.
I also have never heard the term bodega until ScRym mentioned it.
A "bodega" is distinct from other types of similar stores.
"Hobo" means something very specific here.
The subway has a whole lexicon and mythology of its own.
I'm familiar with two definitions for the word "hobo." One, which I think is the more modern one, is another word for "bum" -- i.e. your standard homeless, possibly alcoholic/drug addicted/mentally ill or any combination of the three person with poor hygiene. The other is the more old-fashioned term, which is a basically a homeless vagrant who'd travel from town to town trying to scrounge up work and meals, often by stowing away on cargo trains and such. You know, those old-timey pictures of guys with stubble and bindle sticks over their shoulders carrying their stuff.
I assume the NYC "hobo" is none of the above or perhaps a special case of "bum."
Hobo - migratory, non-working
Tramp - migratory, working
Bum - non-migratory, non-working
After I lived in New York:
Hobo:
1. likely homeless
2. exhibiting a horrible stench
3. underground (or in a subway car)
Bum
1. likely homeless
2. panhandling or otherwise harassing people
3. above ground (not in a subway car)
I have different, less commonly used words or descriptions for other types of people, but I use these two words pretty consistently.
Confusingly, "bumfog" is the term for the smell of a hobo that lingers even when they have moved on. I personally refer to it sometimes as "Eau de Hobo."
Convention stinkbombs have the reek of the unshowered. Subway hobos have the stink of urine mixed with vomit and feces that has had time to mature.
Even if caused by irrationality, it's still deliberate self inflicted behavior. The tragedy itself is not the stench but that it's underlying cause is likely avoidable.
I think about 99% of those cases of that kind of stench are not deliberate. They are not making a choice. Those folks are mentally ill and untreated, perhaps untreatable. It's just sad circumstances.
I used to help with this free showers thing in the Bowery, and getting some of those people through the system was balls hard. We'd get somebody a private shower and a new set of clothes. We did it one day a week. It was men only. At the same time we'd have a lottery system for a place to stay for a week. In short - I'd never exercised my gag reflex so frequently in all my life.
There's just not a catch-all for this problem and probably never will be.
We invest in a health care system that has the resources to intervene individually in these peoples' lives and follow through to a positive, or at least neutral, outcome.
I've had family members slip into "hobodom" and vanish. It's not pretty but I think it is, to a very large extent, preventable.
Did you ever see that documentary... The Cats of Mirikitani? That kind of gives me hope about this kind of thing.