You can forgive them?! Really? My attitude is this: How dare people come to an open place that welcomes them and desperately seeks their patronage, particularly on the most celebrated days of the year. Fuck those assholes for not worshiping or participating in the way one particular guy wants them to.
^_^
Actually, my church doesn't ask for the patronage of guests. They specifically ask guests not to give money.
...Wow, that was kinda harsh. I mean, you're right, but I could just feel the anger through the internet.
No, no anger. Seriously, this is what Jesus preached. It's God's job to judge people, not your's. At least that's what I've heard. ^_^
I know that's what Jesus preached, but an Atheist telling me "to forgive" is usually a snide comment, attempting to imply something about my own faithfulness to my defended beliefs. Sorry if I read too much into it.
I may be an atheist, but I do think their would be a lot less problems with this world if people followed Jesus' teachings more. I mean the dude forgave all of mankind for nailing him to a cross. I just can't imagine getting wound up over things like this is what he would have wanted.
I may be an atheist, but I do think their would be a lot less problems with this world if people followed Jesus' teachings more. I mean the dude forgave all of mankind for nailing him to a cross. I just can't imagine getting wound up over things like this is what he would have wanted.
You're right, I am being rather petty. I apologize.
My attitude is this: How dare people come to an open place that welcomes them and desperately seeks their patronage, particularly on the most celebrated days of the year. Fuck those assholes for not worshiping or participating in the way one particular guy wants them to.
^_^
That's ridiculous. There's a huge difference between being outright rude and being unengaged. I'd venture to say a large number of the unengaged are actually members of the church who aren't "forced" to go anyway. Church isn't just for people who have 100% accepted everything the pastor says. They don't expect everyone to be 100% engaged. However, casting dirty looks, acting flagrantly disrespectful, or vocally insulting the service is unacceptable behavior no matter why you are there (unless you were forcefully dragged into the building). Those people need to grow up. Kids I can understand; many of them are actually forced to be there by their circumstances. Adults have choices, and if you are going to chose to visit a Church so that things go smoother with your family, then step up to the choice you have made instead of being a whiny little bitch.
Please understand that I am in no way asserting that you, Kate, are a whiny little bitch. This is just a general statement about people and their choices.
What about atheists forced to go to church because they are hiding it from their extremely religious families? Whenever I get stuck going to my parent's church I just try to see it as an opportunity to see people I used to know. I don't mock anything because I used to be Christian, and I know how it used to feel. I only got mad at the preacher once when he said something like "those scientists don't know anything", but I kept it to myself.
I also think a lot of people go to church on holidays simply because its the popular thing to do. We know how people like to fit in socially... 0:)
There are a number of legitimate reasons to go to church without wanting to be there. If you do so, you should make your best effort not to be intrusive. However, what if you're exposed to ideas that you consider to be outright harmful? Tolerance has to end somewhere.
but an Atheist telling me "to forgive" is usually a snide comment, attempting to imply something about my own faithfulness to my defended beliefs.
Axel, you're being such a cunt trying to read so much into a single line. Christians don't have any exclusive rights to forgive or tell others to forgive. Hell, I've come across more Christians making snide comments to forgive them than atheists for that matter. So stop turning circles in your church bench looking about and pay attention to your sermon. Go and metaphorically slap those who force people to come along to church on the fingers instead of those who are forced to come along as long as the latter aren't being intrusive cunts. You're still a fucking human being, no more right or wrong than any other.
but an Atheist telling me "to forgive" is usually a snide comment, attempting to imply something about my own faithfulness to my defended beliefs.
Axel, you're being such a cunt trying to read so much into a single line. Christians don't have any exclusive rights to forgive or tell others to forgive. Hell, I've come across more Christians making snide comments to forgive them than atheists for that matter. So stop turning circles in your church bench looking about and pay attention to your sermon. Go and metaphorically slap those who force people to come along to church on the fingers instead of those who are forced to come along as long as the latter aren't being intrusive cunts. You're still a fucking human being, no more right or wrong than any other.
No matter what side you are on, you can be a dick about it. And right now you are. Chill
Yeah, but his assholing was moot, because Axel already apologized for being petty about that particular subject. Way to be late to the game. If he's going to be an ass, then he could at least be punctual. ^_~
No matter what side you are on, you can be a dick about it. And right now you are. Chill
Now, I understand that you wish to sound like some voice of reason, but instead you just sound like a dickish captain Obvious, for which themoreyouknow.jpg is normally used, whereas I was just harsh. I hope you'll learn the difference, since it might save your life one day.
Yeah, but his assholing was moot, because Axel already apologized for being petty about that particular subject. Way to be late to the game. If he's going to be an ass, then he could at least be punctual. ^_~
Problem: I was not being an asshole. Merely speaking my mind in response to the discussion that had passed. Fuck any apologies that are posted 10 minutes after the post I picked to quote, the statement I made requires none.
Please understand that I am in no way asserting that you, Kate, are a whiny little bitch. This is just a general statement about people and their choices.
LOL. As I said before, if someone is being disruptive, then they need to get the heck out of there. I was more pointing out that just because someone doesn't meet Axel's particular standards for worship doesn't mean they are being disrespectful. :P
God. Which churches are YOU guys going to, where they don't constantly ask for money or look down on everyone who doesn't share their beliefs?
I'm an Atheist. I go to church every week with my relatives. There have been SO many times where I REALLY have to fight the urge to just get up and argue with the Priest's ridiculous sermon statements. This isn't even exclusive to just the churches in my area! I've been to many MANY churches around the US, most of which incite the same type of response from me. Honestly, Nuri, I envy you for going to a church that's somewhat respectful, but that experience seems quite atypical. It's like being dragged to a Scientologist cult gathering and watching everyone praise such ridiculous statements and beliefs. Some of the sermons our Catholic priests have given just incites such vitriol inside me.
Perhaps it's because you attended a church for a different religious belief, but Catholicism is the most widespread, and that type of experience is probably far more common.
No matter what side you are on, you can be a dick about it. And right now you are. Chill.
There's a difference between being a dick and making a pointed statement.
Like I said, Lutheran and Episcopalian. Episcopal church is basically Anglican Lite... they're super open. I only went a few times, because I hate listening to people recite litanies in a dead voice, so I can't really handle frequent visits. If they sound like they meant it, that would be all right... but they sound like sheep repeating meaningless words, and it drives me crazy. Lutherans are pretty much the original protestants, so their whole belief system is structured around putting the interpretation of the readings into the hands of the people. It's very focused on doing your own introspection, and much less on "here is what you should be doing, now go be good little God sheep."
I would never got to a Catholic service, ever, unless it was to save someone's life or something.
I've been to a Baptist service before... and it was pretty ridiculous at times. Not quite Glen Beck, but some of the statements were getting there. The only saving grace was that one of the ministers (they have several) was the father of the girl I went with, so I knew 100% that their family actually lived by their professed beliefs (his statements were actually pretty sensible). They asked me one time if I had heard about Jesus, and once I gave them my honest answer, they never asked me about it or tried to pressure me again. They also continued to behave exactly the same as far as acceptance and friendliness went. Not the typical Christians that I grew up around... I can respect you if you actually practice what you preach.
Lutherans are pretty much the original protestants, so their whole belief system is structured around putting the interpretation of the readings into the hands of the people. It's very focused on doing your own introspection, and much less on "here is what you should be doing, now go be good little God sheep."
Plus forgiving pretty much everything if you say "hey Jesus, sorry about that, I'll try harder next time". They're also fans of casserole, potlucks, and often (in my experience) open discussion of religious beliefs outside of Christianity. If you have to pick, being Lutheran is a pretty good way to go, even though the denomination was started by a pretty crazy guy.
It's like being dragged to a Scientologist cult gathering and watching everyone praise such ridiculous statements and beliefs. Some of the sermons our Catholic priests have given just incites such vitriol inside me.
I can honestly say that I have never had disagreements of such sort while listening to a sermon inside of a church. Other pastors outside of a homily are a different story.
I grew up in a craaaaaaaazy evangelical church. Not quite snake-handlers, but way into faith-healing-speaking-in-tongues-passing-out-on-the-floor territory. My girlfriend grew up with atheist parents. So when we see that stuff on TV or whatever, she gets all creeped out by it, but as crazy as it is, it just feels like being a kid to me.
Comments
Please understand that I am in no way asserting that you, Kate, are a whiny little bitch. This is just a general statement about people and their choices.
I also think a lot of people go to church on holidays simply because its the popular thing to do. We know how people like to fit in socially... 0:)
I'm an Atheist. I go to church every week with my relatives. There have been SO many times where I REALLY have to fight the urge to just get up and argue with the Priest's ridiculous sermon statements. This isn't even exclusive to just the churches in my area! I've been to many MANY churches around the US, most of which incite the same type of response from me. Honestly, Nuri, I envy you for going to a church that's somewhat respectful, but that experience seems quite atypical. It's like being dragged to a Scientologist cult gathering and watching everyone praise such ridiculous statements and beliefs. Some of the sermons our Catholic priests have given just incites such vitriol inside me.
Perhaps it's because you attended a church for a different religious belief, but Catholicism is the most widespread, and that type of experience is probably far more common. There's a difference between being a dick and making a pointed statement.
I would never got to a Catholic service, ever, unless it was to save someone's life or something.
I've been to a Baptist service before... and it was pretty ridiculous at times. Not quite Glen Beck, but some of the statements were getting there. The only saving grace was that one of the ministers (they have several) was the father of the girl I went with, so I knew 100% that their family actually lived by their professed beliefs (his statements were actually pretty sensible). They asked me one time if I had heard about Jesus, and once I gave them my honest answer, they never asked me about it or tried to pressure me again. They also continued to behave exactly the same as far as acceptance and friendliness went. Not the typical Christians that I grew up around... I can respect you if you actually practice what you preach.