I'm all for joining this political party. There's an atheist meetup group in the Capital District that may also be interested in joining. Keep me in the loop about this.
It completely depends on the actual platform that he puts forth. The name sounds great, but I could call a party the "Peace, Love, and Kittens" party and create a platform whose main agenda is further bankrupting the world economy in an effort to bring down all monetary based systems.
Hey, at least it's something different. :P
The concept sounds solid to me; obviously, I'll want to hear the actual platform of the party, but as long as it's in line with the preliminary ideas that Rym's put forth, I can see myself getting behind it.
Though, I won't lie, an idealistic (though not very realistic part of me) thinks that monetary systems only lead to corruption, greed, opportunism, oppression, and a greater degradation of the human race and would love to see them abolished, but I digress.
To any whiners who whine, "Oh, why can't you use this as an opportunity to repent from your hypocrisy and say that Obama is handling this wrong", a new NBC/WSJ poll finds that the number of people who think Obama is handling anything badly "hasn't budged" since the teabagger's crazy town hall shenanigans.
To any whiners who whine, "Oh, why can't you use this as an opportunity to repent from your hypocrisy and say that Obama is handling this wrong", a new NBC/WSJ poll finds that the number of people who think Obama is handling anything badly"hasn't budged"since the teabagger's crazy town hall shenanigans.
To any whiners who whine, "Oh, why can't you use this as an opportunity to repent from your hypocrisy and say that Obama is handling this wrong", a new NBC/WSJ poll finds that the number of people who think Obama is handling anything badly"hasn't budged"since the teabagger's crazy town hall shenanigans.
As the post says, epic fail for the teabaggers.
So Obama caved on the public option despite there being no change in public opinion? Ouch.
Give me proof that the public option was dropped? (other then hearsay and people saying it out of their butt)
To any whiners who whine, "Oh, why can't you use this as an opportunity to repent from your hypocrisy and say that Obama is handling this wrong", a new NBC/WSJ poll finds that the number of people who think Obama is handling anything badly"hasn't budged"since the teabagger's crazy town hall shenanigans.
As the post says, epic fail for the teabaggers.
So Obama caved on the public option despite there being no change in public opinion? Ouch.
I'm gathering it had more to do with opposition from GOP lawmakers. It's a two-party system, and in order to get things passed, you have to deal with that.
I'm not thrilled about dropping the public option, but I view it as a byproduct of our divisive system rather than necessarily a weakness on Obama's part. At the end of the day, it's more important to take a small step forward, as long as you're moving forward.
EDIT: Yes, I thought it was still at the "we're open to negotiation" stage with regard to the public option. Obama expressed a willingness to compromise. I didn't think it had actually been dropped yet, though as I said, I'm not thrilled at the prospect.
To any whiners who whine, "Oh, why can't you use this as an opportunity to repent from your hypocrisy and say that Obama is handling this wrong", a new NBC/WSJ poll finds that the number of people who think Obama is handling anything badly"hasn't budged"since the teabagger's crazy town hall shenanigans.
As the post says, epic fail for the teabaggers.
So Obama caved on the public option despite there being no change in public opinion? Ouch.
Give me proof that the public option was dropped? (other then hearsay and people saying it out of their butt)
K: But . . . but . . . but I don't like him . . . and he's all hypocritical and stuff . . . and here's a magazine article . . . and passion, the teabaggers have passion. . . and liberals are all hypocritical.
And . . . and I'm gonna stop listening to the show! So there! And I'm gonna stop posting too!
Give me proof that the public option was dropped? (other then hearsay and people saying it out of their butt)
It's not official, but he is hinting. I suspect that he would not hint unless he was serious about dropping the public option. If he is intent on keeping it, he's a terrible negotiator.
For the sake of a health care deal, President Obama is hinting that he may be willing to drop the idea of a government-run insurance plan to compete with private insurers and hold down premium costs.
"Hinting that he may be willing"? That's pretty rock-solid evidence right there. Cremlian, would you need any more credible evidence than that, or was that the hearsay and "people saying it out of their butt" that you were talking about?
K: But . . . but . . . but I don't like him . . . and he's all hypocritical and stuff . . . and here's a magazine article . . . and passion, the teabaggers have passion. . . and liberals are all hypocritical.
I like Obama. I just don't think that complaining about the teabaggers is worth the effort. Even though I like Obama, I'm able to criticize certain aspects of his presidency. Nobody's perfect, and I'm not saying that anyone else would do better. But if you write the best computer program that still has some relevant bugs do you not try to fix the bugs? Constructive criticism isn't a terrible thing.
"Hintingthat hemaybewilling"? That's pretty rock-solid evidence right there. Cremlian, would you need any more credible evidence than that, or was that the hearsay and "pulling it out of their butt" that you were talking about?
That goes back to my earlier point. If he is serious about keeping the public option, his negotiating skills need a lot of work.
"Hintingthat hemaybewilling"? That's pretty rock-solid evidence right there. Cremlian, would you need any more credible evidence than that, or was that the hearsay and "pulling it out of their butt" that you were talking about?
That goes back to my earlier point. If he is serious about keeping the public option, his negotiating skills need a lot of work.
Actually, I think it's more germane to and it goes back more to Cremlian's earlier point about the only evidence that Obama is willing to give up the public option being hearsay or "people saying it out of their butt."
After all I ranting and raving I did in the Obama thread about this I'm of the opinion that I want to see a proposal for a public option, or at the very least a rough outline. I want more than pointing at medicare, that's a system designed to meet different needs.
Actually, I think it's more germane to and it goes back more to Cremlian's earlier point about the only evidence that Obama is willing to give up the public option being hearsay or "people saying it out of their butt."
Wait, wouldn't the Peace, Love and Kittens party be a party all about War, Hate and Kitten Extermination? At least it isn't the Happiness Realization Party.
Actually, I think it's more germane to and it goes back more to Cremlian's earlier point about the only evidence that Obama is willing to give up the public option being hearsay or "people saying it out of their butt."
Yeah, all that article does is give even more weight to Cremlian's position that the only evidence that Obama is willing to give up the public option is "people saying it out of their butt."
If you hear an administration official on some TV show say, "It is within the realm of possibility, even though it is unlikely, that the president may, at some undefined point in the future, be persuaded to be willing to consider the eventuality of perhaps allowing a proposal to be heard on a tentative basis that would open the door to the remote chance that every American will receive a kitten.", that doesn't mean it's time to go shopping for a litter box.
Bad fucking ass!!!! I wish I lived in Mass so I could say he was my congressman. :P
If you hear an administration official on some TV show say, "It is within the realm of possibility, even though it is unlikely, that the president may, at some undefined point in the future, be persuaded to be willing to consider the eventuality of perhaps allowing a proposal to be heard on a tentative basis that would open the door to the remote chance that every American will receive a kitten.", that doesn't mean it's time to go shopping for a litter box.
But I don't want a government issued kitten, I'm allergic.
But I don't want a government issued kitten, I'm allergic.
You realize the public option is for people who don't have insurance, get a job with insurance and your covered and you don't get a government issued kitten.
You realize the public option is for people who don't have insurance, get a job with insurance and your covered and you don't get a government issued kitten.
LOL, that wasn't some subtle "I don't want government in my medicine." I'm just allergic to cats. :P
Lol, but the point is, if you read and understand the quote, you're not likely to need to worry about getting a kitten.
What a relief, I was getting all scared and panicky at the thought of such an awful idea.
If you hear an administration official on some TV show say, "It is within the realm of possibility, even though it is unlikely, that the president may, at some undefined point in the future, be persuaded to be willing to consider the eventuality of perhaps allowing a proposal to be heard on a tentative basis that would open the door to the remote chance that every American will receive a kitten.", that doesn't mean it's time to go shopping for a litter box.
Talk about comparing apples and oranges. My point is that if Obama is serious about a public option, having his top administration officials open the door to dispensing with a public option is either a) an indication that Obama has given up on a public option; or b) an example of terrible negotiating skills.
Either option is troubling. Anyone who has ever done negotiationg knows that if you suggest you are willing to give something up, it's as good as given up. You may set conditions, but there can be no pretending that you are steadfast.
I just have fears that the two-party system will make any health care reform overly expensive and impotent. I would blame both parties if that were to happen.
Lol, but the point is, if you read and understand the quote, you're not likely to need to worry about getting a kitten.
What a relief, I was getting all scared and panicky at the thought of such an awful idea.
That's how to read highly conditional statements. Some people might be fooled when some official says "We might be open to considering dropping the public option" because they're either desperately looking for a way to criticize the administration, they have a poor education, or they're intellectually lazy, but Cremlian correctly showed how to analyze such statements by saying that those people are "talking out of their butts". Bravo, Cremlian.
That's how to read highly conditional statements. Some people might be fooled when some official says "We might be open to considering dropping the public option" because they're either desperately looking for a way to criticize the administration, they have a poor education, or they're intellectually lazy, but Cremlian correctly showed how to analyze such statements by saying that those people are "talking out of their butts". Bravo, Cremlian.
FYI, I was poking fun at people who get all wound up at the mere mention of the possibility of something in the news. My reading skills are quite well developed, though my writing could use some work.
but Cremlian correctly showed how to analyze such statements by saying that those people are "talking out of their butts". Bravo, Cremlian.
The simple truth is that you don't know. They may be talking out of their butts, and they may not be. Only Obama and those people know.
However, the mere suggestion by a top administration officials that the administration is willing to concede on a public option should give any proponent of a public option reason to be concerned. Only a fool would dismiss such talk outright.
This isn't a liberal-conservative issue. Howard Dean is worried. I don't think that he's a conservative.
The simple truth is that you don't know. They may be talking out of their butts, and they may not be. Only Obama and those people know.
But they have studies and data. Are you saying that all of that was fabricated?
However, the mere suggestion by a top administration officials that the administration is willing to concede on a public option should give any proponent of a public option reason to be concerned.
Comments
The concept sounds solid to me; obviously, I'll want to hear the actual platform of the party, but as long as it's in line with the preliminary ideas that Rym's put forth, I can see myself getting behind it.
As the post says, epic fail for the teabaggers.
Let's talk about issues that really matter.
I'm not thrilled about dropping the public option, but I view it as a byproduct of our divisive system rather than necessarily a weakness on Obama's part. At the end of the day, it's more important to take a small step forward, as long as you're moving forward.
EDIT: Yes, I thought it was still at the "we're open to negotiation" stage with regard to the public option. Obama expressed a willingness to compromise. I didn't think it had actually been dropped yet, though as I said, I'm not thrilled at the prospect.
And . . . and I'm gonna stop listening to the show! So there! And I'm gonna stop posting too!
If you hear an administration official on some TV show say, "It is within the realm of possibility, even though it is unlikely, that the president may, at some undefined point in the future, be persuaded to be willing to consider the eventuality of perhaps allowing a proposal to be heard on a tentative basis that would open the door to the remote chance that every American will receive a kitten.", that doesn't mean it's time to go shopping for a litter box.
(oh and Barney Frank is a congressmen)
a) an indication that Obama has given up on a public option; or
b) an example of terrible negotiating skills.
Either option is troubling. Anyone who has ever done negotiationg knows that if you suggest you are willing to give something up, it's as good as given up. You may set conditions, but there can be no pretending that you are steadfast.
I just have fears that the two-party system will make any health care reform overly expensive and impotent. I would blame both parties if that were to happen.
However, the mere suggestion by a top administration officials that the administration is willing to concede on a public option should give any proponent of a public option reason to be concerned. Only a fool would dismiss such talk outright.
This isn't a liberal-conservative issue. Howard Dean is worried. I don't think that he's a conservative.