Another VERY useful shortcut. DF, D, DF will do a shoryuken. (Or any other z pattern move.) Not only is this quicker, easier, and more consistent it allows you do to the z motion without standing up. Considering that z motion moves are usually anti air moves this is very useful.
WTF! Is this in the manual? Can I do Bison's teleport this way?
Another VERY useful shortcut. DF, D, DF will do a shoryuken. (Or any other z pattern move.) Not only is this quicker, easier, and more consistent it allows you do to the z motion without standing up. Considering that z motion moves are usually anti air moves this is very useful.
WTF! Is this in the manual? Can I do Bison's teleport this way?
Is it in the manual? Nope. Its totally super secret and totally BS they still tell you to do the normal "Z" motion. I found this out by accident because I was in training mode and did a Shoryuken when I shouldn't have and was like "wtf?". Upon investigation I found it was a shortcut capcom added to the game and told no one. They added a few of these short cuts so "new" players could do motions that are close to the desired motion and still get moves off. I don't see why they just don't tell you the shortcut methods and instead hide it all.
Although I would have to load up the game to check as I do not use Bison, yes, Bison's teleport should work the same way. ALL z motion moves can be done via this shortcut.
Other quick Bison tips. You have roughly 1 second of buffer before charge you store is lost. As such, You could hold DB for two seconds to gain charge, let go off DB, do a standing jab, then press F weak kick to land a knee press combo. Although this particular combo is not useful the concept that your charge carries for a certain period of time is. Especially for doing Supers/Ultras. You have roughly 1 second of buffer before the game forgets you put in an input. As such you can fairly slowly execute double quarter circle or B,F,B,F charge ultras and still have it come out.
Also, even if a button input is used to preform an action the game does not forget that the button input has already been imputed and it will count towards the necessary button inputs to preform other actions. For example with Ryu you can do the command, D,DF,F Punch, D,DF,F, Punch and get a fire ball then Super fire ball to come out in a combo. (D,DF,F Punch = Hadouken. D,DF,F,D,DF,F Punch = Super Hadouken) This concept is essential for doing more difficult combos in a calm and controlled manner.
Edit* Scot "I realized that I wouldn't be able to beat anyone in a fighting game that was Korean..." LOL. In my social group we refereed to anyone that was exceptionally good at Fighting Games/Star Craft as"asian good".
Another VERY useful shortcut. DF, D, DF will do a shoryuken. (Or any other z pattern move.)
We may be talking about the same thing here, but you really only need DF,DF,P. It's incredibly easy to mash out with a stick that has a square gate (which I think all Sanwa sticks do). And like you said about combined button presses counting toward special/super moves, I like DF,P,DF,P as a quick, easy combo.
Also, just in case it would be helpful to anyone that missed it, if you're learning Street Fighter, you really should check out Theory Fighter.
Another VERY useful shortcut. DF, D, DF will do a shoryuken. (Or any other z pattern move.)
We may be talking about the same thing here, but you really only need DF,DF,P. It's incredibly easy to mash out with a stick that has a square gate (which I think all Sanwa sticks do). And like you said about combined button presses counting toward special/super moves, I like DF,P,DF,P as a quick, easy combo.
Also, just in case it would be helpful to anyone that missed it, if you're learning Street Fighter, youreally shouldcheck outTheory Fighter.
Yep we are talking about the same thing. Unless you have a square gate stick though you can make mistakes. So I generally tell people to do DF, D, DF. Both executions have appropriate times to be used. DF,DF is generally quicker. DF,D,DF allows you to do the z motion while remaining crouched.
Maybe someone can help me out with this. The main problem I'm having right now is standing up. If I get knocked down to the ground, I get up very slowly. I see other people getting up quickly. How do you do that?
Also, regardless of whether I get up slowly or quickly, does M. Bison have a good get-up move? I know that Ryu can just do a shoryuken to get up immediately and invincibly. It's basically guaranteed that a Ryu on the ground will do a shoryuken if you are close to them. But what can M. Bison do?
I seem to have extra special trouble against characters like Abel or Zangief who will throw or slam me as soon as I get up, because that just puts me on the ground again immediately, and it repeats until I'm dead. I don't even get a chance to do anything. At least with someone else I can try to block immediately upon getting up, but you can't block a throw.
Also, when you are on the ground, when can you begin inputting commands? Can I charge when I'm on the ground? If I can charge while I'm on the ground, at what point in the getting up animation can I release the charge and actually do a move?
If I get knocked down to the ground, I get up very slowly. I see other people getting up quickly. How do you do that?
Press down as soon as you hit the ground. (It might be any direction, but down definitely works.) You have to get the timing right. It doesn't work if you're thrown, or under certain other circumstances.
It's basically guaranteed that a Ryu on the ground will do a shoryuken if you are close to them.
Only if he's not very good. If he keeps doing that, you can easily bait him by standing close, block when he gets up, then punish him. Good players will mix it up -- getting up with a FADC (focus attack-dash cancel) backward is pretty safe.
I seem to have extra special trouble against characters like Abel or Zangief who will throw or slam me as soon as I get up, because that just puts me on the ground again immediately, and it repeats until I'm dead. I don't even get a chance to do anything. At least with someone else I can try to block immediately upon getting up, but you can't block a throw.
Read this thread. EDIT: Against Abel at least, try a back teleport on wakeup. It seems to work in training mode with a recorded opponent.
Also, when you are on the ground, when can you begin inputting commands? Can I charge when I'm on the ground? If I can charge while I'm on the ground, at what point in the getting up animation can I release the charge and actually do a move?
Yes. You can charge at ANY TIME, even before the match begins -- i.e. during "round 1!" and throw it as soon as he says "fight!"
Also, regardless of whether I get up slowly or quickly, does M. Bison have a good get-up move? I know that Ryu can just do a shoryuken to get up immediately and invincibly. It's basically guaranteed that a Ryu on the ground will do a shoryuken if you are close to them. But what can M. Bison do?
Besides waking up with block or a back dash, Bison can also wake up with an ex head stomp. Your invincible the entire way up so its pretty safe. After the head stomp direct yourself as far away from your opponent as possible and attack if he tries to follow you before you land. You will generally win an air to air conflict with the punch move bison does after a head stomp. Against command grabs either a backdash or a neutral jump will avoid the grab. Just hold UB as you wake up and you will jump immediately.
Also, when you are on the ground, when can you begin inputting commands? Can I charge when I'm on the ground? If I can charge while I'm on the ground, at what point in the getting up animation can I release the charge and actually do a move?
Release your charge just before your finished standing up. This is just an experience thing. Eventually you'll get used to when to release moves while standing up to have them come out. Certain characters stand up faster then others. So the timing isn't universal.
*edit* I would also suggest abusing HK allot against the computer. It will hit often and on block is safe if you do the move from the edge of the hit box. This is good practice as the standing HK is one of Bisons best normal moves and should be used frequently. As a Bison player you should know the range of the move and what it can/can not stuff. Using it frequently against the computer will help you with this.
The sad part is, none of this surprises me. I have been forced enough into elitism that I immediately thought "Duh, Scott, of course you can cancel in a fighting game, dear God," before I realized I was being a pretentious butthole. I don't even use these advanced moves in games like Brawl and I know about them...
I don't even use these advanced moves in games like Brawl and I know about them...
This is the thing. I've known the word cancel for a long time. The problem is not just knowing the word, but knowing exactly what a cancel is, and how to do it. Even telling someone to just do one move while the other move is happening is not sufficient, or even correct. Many cancels are actually a new sequence of button presses that are some combination of two other moves merged into one.
Also, Smash Bros. has notoriously bad instructions in terms of telling players all the rules.
I don't even use these advanced moves in games like Brawl and I know about them...
This is the thing. I've known the word cancel for a long time. The problem is not just knowing the word, but knowing exactly what a cancel is, and how to do it. Even telling someone to just do one move while the other move is happening is not sufficient, or even correct. Many cancels are actually a new sequence of button presses that are some combination of two other moves merged into one.
Also, Smash Bros. has notoriously bad instructions in terms of telling players all the rules.
That is true. But I still knew what a cancel, and a tech, and other advanced things were, and somewhat of how to do them. I definitely knew how to tech, or Ukemi as it is apparently known as by the game creators, I just could never remember to do it in between getting massacred by all my friends. But in the end, learning all those advanced techniques sucked all the fun out of the game, so I decided to stick with just having fun.
But in the end, learning all those advanced techniques sucked all the fun out of the game, so I decided to stick with just having fun.
Once one understands a game, it comes down to a choice of whether or not mastery of that understanding is worthwhile in the execution. WoW, for example, is fairly simple in understanding, capped in mastery, and long in execution. Street Fighter has hidden understanding coupled with a long road to mastery. Understanding still eludes us in Tigris & Euphrates.
Sort of, but these glitches are much harder to exploit in Brawl. How many people do you know that can Snake Dash on command, how about use Pikachu's Quick Attack ground cancel, or even chain grab effectively? Compare that to the number of people who exploited snaking and completely broke Mario Kart DS. The glitches in Brawl don't break the game, it just makes the top tier even harder to get into.
Once one understands a game, it comes down to a choice of whether or not mastery of that understanding is worthwhile in the execution.
I love games where there are many levels of understanding, and at each level there is a new set of skills to master. I think that's why NS appeals to me so much. At the moment I'm just trying to master the role of marine, but I know there are are many different roles I could turn to next to try to master them too. But to be honest I think I'll wait for NS2 before I put a lot of effort into learning how to skulk and fade and lurk properly.
Last night I played a few games with the best com I've ever encountered. He set up a siege game in such a way that we won the game with ZERO deaths. His level of understanding of the map and the timing of upgrades and deployment was amazing. I mean, now I saw how he did it, I'm not sure if I can enjoy playing the same map again, knowing it is "solved" to such a high degree. And then we played a really fun 40+ minute game in which he again showed complete mastery of the map, and as he'd won the previous game so handily the entire team, we all trusted him completely. Even though we lost most of the map after about 10 minutes, I never once thought that we wouldn't win. And again, in the last 15 minutes of the game, the aliens didn't get more than one or two kills.
I got a glimpse at what it was like to REALLY master NS.
how about use Pikachu's Quick Attack ground cancel
I can actually do this. It's what makes my Pikachu so different from other Pikachus in my area. Still, all of these "exploits" have limited usability, since they aren't at all game-breaking. My friends who don't take advantage of these little quirks are still perfectly capable of beating the people who don't use them.
In the end, though, I much prefer Street Fighter 4 over Brawl as a competitive fighter...and BlazBlue over Street Fighter 4. :P
A few notes about the episode: 1. When it comes to developing for the PS3/360, there arises an issue with the idea of making the combo packs. When companies make these multi-platform games, they develop for the 360 and then port the game to the PS3. It is much more expensive to make games for the PS3, so do what I just said above. This is why the PS3 version of Bayonetta is inferior to the 360 version (besides the fact that it's a shoddy port). 2. Scott, buy Bayonetta. You will not be disappointed.
In a lot of ways, yes. I was a big fan of Guilty Gear X2 during its day, but BlazBlue (in my opinion) has overshadowed GG in many ways.
The game seems interesting. I would like to play it but unless it gets a PC port its unlikely. I can get it for the Wii but online play for the Wii is bad and the controller (chuck or gamecube) is no good for traditional fighting games. From what I've seen in tournament videos the pacing and underlying combo system is very similar to GG XX. I just hope that in high level play v13 doesn't become Eddie. A wall of offense that makes all but 2/3 other characters in the game completely irrelevant.
Blazblue I believe is harder than GGXX. All of the sloppy and lazy tricks you could use in tight situations seem to ahve been refined so that you have to calm down and pick an option. The storyline blew my mind, though. Either really ballsy, or Arc is just trying to avoid Capcom SF2 comparisons by the barest of margins.
Hmm I just did some googleing. The spread on the tiers doesn't seem to be that bad in BlazBlue. v14 is top by a decent margin but not huge. What is it that's so ballsy about the story line?
I love games where there are many levels of understanding, and at each level there is a new set of skills to master. I think that's why NS appeals to me so much. At the moment I'm just trying to master the role of marine, but I know there are are many different roles I could turn to next to try to master them too. But to be honest I think I'll wait for NS2 before I put a lot of effort into learning how to skulk and fade and lurk properly.
Last night I played a few games with the best com I've ever encountered. He set up a siege game in such a way that we won the game with ZERO deaths. His level of understanding of the map and the timing of upgrades and deployment was amazing. I mean, now I saw how he did it, I'm not sure if I can enjoy playing the same map again, knowing it is "solved" to such a high degree. And then we played a really fun 40+ minute game in which he again showed complete mastery of the map, and as he'd won the previous game so handily the entire team, we all trusted him completely. Even though we lost most of the map after about 10 minutes, I never once thought that we wouldn't win. And again, in the last 15 minutes of the game, the aliens didn't get more than one or two kills.
I got a glimpse at what it was like to REALLY master NS.
He knew the true secrets - war is intellect, and it is conviction.
This episode made me whip out my fight stick and start playing SFIV again. Also, I was finally able to execute the charge super/ultra moves thanks to Scott's description of the stick movement. Doesn't mean I'll start playing as Guile or M. Bison any time soon though.
This episode made me whip out my fight stick [...] Also, I was finally able to execute the charge super/ultra moves thanks to Scott's description of the stick movement.
Comments
Although I would have to load up the game to check as I do not use Bison, yes, Bison's teleport should work the same way. ALL z motion moves can be done via this shortcut.
Other quick Bison tips. You have roughly 1 second of buffer before charge you store is lost. As such, You could hold DB for two seconds to gain charge, let go off DB, do a standing jab, then press F weak kick to land a knee press combo. Although this particular combo is not useful the concept that your charge carries for a certain period of time is. Especially for doing Supers/Ultras. You have roughly 1 second of buffer before the game forgets you put in an input. As such you can fairly slowly execute double quarter circle or B,F,B,F charge ultras and still have it come out.
Also, even if a button input is used to preform an action the game does not forget that the button input has already been imputed and it will count towards the necessary button inputs to preform other actions. For example with Ryu you can do the command, D,DF,F Punch, D,DF,F, Punch and get a fire ball then Super fire ball to come out in a combo. (D,DF,F Punch = Hadouken. D,DF,F,D,DF,F Punch = Super Hadouken) This concept is essential for doing more difficult combos in a calm and controlled manner.
Edit* Scot "I realized that I wouldn't be able to beat anyone in a fighting game that was Korean..." LOL. In my social group we refereed to anyone that was exceptionally good at Fighting Games/Star Craft as"asian good".
Also, just in case it would be helpful to anyone that missed it, if you're learning Street Fighter, you really should check out Theory Fighter.
Also, regardless of whether I get up slowly or quickly, does M. Bison have a good get-up move? I know that Ryu can just do a shoryuken to get up immediately and invincibly. It's basically guaranteed that a Ryu on the ground will do a shoryuken if you are close to them. But what can M. Bison do?
I seem to have extra special trouble against characters like Abel or Zangief who will throw or slam me as soon as I get up, because that just puts me on the ground again immediately, and it repeats until I'm dead. I don't even get a chance to do anything. At least with someone else I can try to block immediately upon getting up, but you can't block a throw.
Also, when you are on the ground, when can you begin inputting commands? Can I charge when I'm on the ground? If I can charge while I'm on the ground, at what point in the getting up animation can I release the charge and actually do a move?
EDIT: Against Abel at least, try a back teleport on wakeup. It seems to work in training mode with a recorded opponent. Yes. You can charge at ANY TIME, even before the match begins -- i.e. during "round 1!" and throw it as soon as he says "fight!"
*edit*
I would also suggest abusing HK allot against the computer. It will hit often and on block is safe if you do the move from the edge of the hit box. This is good practice as the standing HK is one of Bisons best normal moves and should be used frequently. As a Bison player you should know the range of the move and what it can/can not stuff. Using it frequently against the computer will help you with this.
Also, Smash Bros. has notoriously bad instructions in terms of telling players all the rules.
Last night I played a few games with the best com I've ever encountered. He set up a siege game in such a way that we won the game with ZERO deaths. His level of understanding of the map and the timing of upgrades and deployment was amazing. I mean, now I saw how he did it, I'm not sure if I can enjoy playing the same map again, knowing it is "solved" to such a high degree. And then we played a really fun 40+ minute game in which he again showed complete mastery of the map, and as he'd won the previous game so handily the entire team, we all trusted him completely. Even though we lost most of the map after about 10 minutes, I never once thought that we wouldn't win. And again, in the last 15 minutes of the game, the aliens didn't get more than one or two kills.
I got a glimpse at what it was like to REALLY master NS.
In the end, though, I much prefer Street Fighter 4 over Brawl as a competitive fighter...and BlazBlue over Street Fighter 4. :P
1. When it comes to developing for the PS3/360, there arises an issue with the idea of making the combo packs. When companies make these multi-platform games, they develop for the 360 and then port the game to the PS3. It is much more expensive to make games for the PS3, so do what I just said above. This is why the PS3 version of Bayonetta is inferior to the 360 version (besides the fact that it's a shoddy port).
2. Scott, buy Bayonetta. You will not be disappointed.