Where the fuck were the blue dogs when the Bush administration did, WHATEVER THE FUCK THEY WANTED????
They did nothing. they were pussies then and they're the same now, more interested in keeping a seat and a job than doing anything for the public that elected them.
As a homework assignment, I had to watch the Michael Moore documentary "Sicko". My jaw hurts from dropping so much. Brits can just walk into a hospital, get treated, then walk out without having to pay a bill? You get compensated for bus or cab fare to the hospital? French people get a mandatory 5 weeks paid vacation? House call doctors still exist in France? Have any of our British forumites seen the film and have they any comments or corrections?
Have any of our British forumites seen the film and have they any comments or corrections?
From what you have said, yes we do have it like that. Heck I even get free medications being in school. I am watching the film right now so I will get back to you on that.
Yeah, because Europeans realized that when people are well-rested and healthy, they are more productive. In America, we say you can rest when you're dead. Work more!
As a homework assignment, I had to watch the Michael Moore documentary "Sicko". My jaw hurts from dropping so much. Brits can just walk into a hospital, get treated, then walk out without having to pay a bill? You get compensated for bus or cab fare to the hospital? French people get a mandatory 5 weeks paid vacation? House call doctors still exist in France? Have any of our British forumites seen the film and have they any comments or corrections?
It isn't quite as awesome as the film makes out but yes we do have free health care. Although you do have to pay for prescriptions, dental treatment, opticians in most cases. The film goes to the best hospital where waiting lists are not really an issue and a doctor can spend more than 10 minutes with a patient. The NHS is by no means perfect as Moore makes out but it is still awesome that if I get ill or have an accident, I don't have to worry that I cannot afford the treatment that is going to make me better or my health insurance won't cover it. Oh and we have had this system since 1948.
My jaw hurts from dropping so much. Brits can just walk into a hospital, get treated, then walk out without having to pay a bill? You get compensated for bus or cab fare to the hospital? French people get a mandatory 5 weeks paid vacation? House call doctors still exist in France? Have any of our British forumites seen the film and have they any comments or corrections?
Sonic, all you see in the film is true, UK doctor are paid well, hospitals are nice places and prescriptions are £6.95 a pop if you are 16-65 and not in full time education. Ummmm, also private doctors in the UK are all sub NHS standards, with a few exceptions.
EDIT: I may have some bias as I live in one of the more affluent areas of London where lots of the problems such as poor diet are not as big an issue.
As a homework assignment, I had to watch the Michael Moore documentary Film "Sicko".
Nothing that man has ever done could be called a documentary, unless you count Hanoi Hannah, Tokyo Rose, and Axis Sally to be "Serious War Journalists".
I mean, christ, He can't even be honest about where he grew up - He talks up how he Grew up in Downtown Flint, Michigan, and builds his entire image around it - when in fact, he grew up in Davidson, Michigan, which is for all intents and purposes separate from Flint everywhere but on paper. It's an affluent and majority white area, filled with white-collar nuclear families. They're currently in the process of breaking away from Flint, and instead becoming a separate city in Davidson county. And Let's not forget how he makes out like his old man was a factory worker at GM, when in reality, he was at white collar as the rest of the place he grew up - He did work in the factory - As the Factory Manager.
I think it is funny that people in the US balk at the idea of waiting lists for medical visits, yet we have to wait quite a bit under the private system. I had to wait months for appointments in the past (even for pressing issues) and several months for surgery. Not to mention that many wait for years when they have no coverage and no ability to pay out of pocket. Waiting for medical care is an issue under every system, so let's just put that complaint to bed, okay?
As a homework assignment, I had to watch the Michael Moore documentary "Sicko". My jaw hurts from dropping so much. Brits can just walk into a hospital, get treated, then walk out without having to pay a bill? You get compensated for bus or cab fare to the hospital? French people get a mandatory 5 weeks paid vacation? House call doctors still exist in France? Have any of our British forumites seen the film and have they any comments or corrections?
That film is a gross exaggeration of socialized healthcare benefits that hardly goes into explaining the massive internal problems the NHS and French healthcare have. Also, that hospital in Cuba is pretty much the only nice one on the island, and you can guarantee they received privileged treatment as Americans.
Michael Moore is a Minister of Propaganda, not a documentarian.
That film is a gross exaggeration of socialized healthcare benefits that hardly goes into explaining the massive internal problems the NHS has.
To the point where I had to sit down with my ex fiance, figure out how to, and then teach her how to game the system so that she could get treatment that she actually needed.
It didn't work in the end, she just took the pills they threw at her and they turned her into an utter fucking mentalist, but when you have to game the system to get the treatment you need, when there are numerous cases of people getting purely cosmetic surgery paid for by the NHS, is just unforgiveable. True, the NHS does have it's upsides, but it's plagued by crippling problems, a labyrinth of paperwork and approvals to get treatment for anything more serious than a cold, and is generally a juggernaut of practically unparalleled bureaucracy.
THIS IS KATE: @ Churba: While I agree with you on most his films, many financial experts from a variety of political backgrounds claim that "Capitalism: A Love Story" presents a lot of solid evidence. While they may disagree on the conclusions that Mr. Moore presents, the facts those conclusions are based on hold up.
THIS IS KATE: @ Churba: While I agree with you on most his films, many financial experts from a variety of political backgrounds claim that "Capitalism: A Love Story" presents a lot of solid evidence. While they may disagree on the conclusions that Mr. Moore presents, the facts those conclusions are based on hold up.
I'm sorry, but a Film indicting Capitalisim, from a Multi-milionare filmmaker, living in a 2 million dollar Manhattan apartment, charges in the region of thirty grand for a short speaking engagement, and spins a giant "An every man(FROM FLINT!) just like you" image just to sell movie tickets, DVDs and Books?
I'm surprised he doesn't make himself sick with his own hypocrisy. I mean, Christ, he railed against corporations taking tax breaks in Capitalisim: a love story, and during the speaking tour for the film, also railed hard against Michigan's tax breaks for filmmakers, which can mean they actually receive more tax than they pay in Michigan while filming there. The very Same Tax break he applied for during the production of "Capitalisim: a love story", was approved for, and gladly took.
As for Facts he presents- I'm going to call Citation Needed on each and every one of them. Moore has a long history of changing, mis-representing, and outright fabricating the "Facts" he presents in his films.
I'm sorry, but a Film indicting Capitalisim, from a Multi-milionare filmmaker, living in a 2 million dollar Manhattan apartment, charges in the region of thirty grand for a short speaking engagement, and spins a giant "An every man(FROM FLINT!) just like you" image just to sell movie tickets, DVDs and Books?
I always had the same problem with Rage Against the Machine. What else can you do, though? It's the reality of filmmaking.
I always had the same problem with Rage Against the Machine. What else can you do, though? It's the reality of filmmaking.
I would have less of a problem if he was just honest about it, rather than trying to sell himself as just some average blue collar slob, when he's anything but. It's his Hypocrisy that bothers me - like I said before, the example of him railing against the very same tax breaks he was applying for and taking.
Yeah, because Europeans realized that when people are well-rested and healthy, they are more productive. In America, we say you can rest when you're dead. Work more!
American workers stay longer in the office, at the factory or on the farm than their counterparts in Europe and most other rich nations, and they produce more per person over the year.
They also get more done per hour than everyone but the Norwegians, according to a U.N. report released Monday, which said the United States "leads the world in labor productivity."
Each U.S. worker produces $63,885 of wealth per year, more than their counterparts in all other countries, the International Labor Organization said in its report. Ireland comes in second at $55,986, ahead of Luxembourg, $55,641; Belgium, $55,235; and France, $54,609.
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This productivity comes at a social cost. Who knows what the proper balance is. But we should at least recognize that our hard work pays off in terms of productivity.
One unfortunate reality is that, in certain professions, being a mother has an unescapable negative career impact. As much as we give lip service to women's rights, in many professions there is room for improvement. For example, certain segments of the legal profession are entirely incompatible with motherhood. The big firms expect you to work insane hours. This can't be done if you want to see your children when they are awake.
Whether you are a man or woman, I have always felt that the people who want to work as an associate in a big firm perversely value money over quality of life. I had a parent that went that route, and another parent that always maintained a good balance. Guess who was much happier in the end - and wasn't wanting for money, either.
Uh yeah, GDP is a bullshit measure of productivity. Price of goods and services being higher makes our GDP higher, even if the material production or the service rate is the same as other countries, and vice versa. You can't measure human productivity country-to-country by GDP when the same things cost significantly different prices from one to the other.
This data was also collected before the financial collapse, so I'm doubting that it reflects the actual wealth of the nation. Lots of companies were overvaluing their assets so egregiously that they almost went out of business. That's got to wreak havok on those numbers, because it means the math in the study was done using FALSE reports.
That's $23B a year, that's pocket change to the Feds.
Not when the Republicans are taking the moral high ground when it comes to spending. Oh yeah, and people will more than likely be paying more on average for their healthcare.
If H.R. 2 was enacted, premiums for health insurance in the individual market would be somewhat lower than under current law, mostly because the average insurance policy in this market would cover a smaller share of enrollees’ costs for health care and a slightly narrower range of benefits. Although premiums in the individual market would be lower, on average, under H.R. 2 than under current law, many people would end up paying more for health insurance—because under current law, the majority of enrollees purchasing coverage in that market would receive subsidies via the insurance exchanges, and H.R. 2 would eliminate those subsidies.
Premiums for employment-based coverage obtained through large employers would be slightly higher under H.R. 2 than under current law. Premiums for employment-based coverage obtained through small employers might be slightly higher or slightly lower (reflecting uncertainty about the impact of the enacted legislation on premiums in that market).
Oh snap! Mandatory government health care in the 18th century? I would argue that this isn't fully analogous to the current situation, but this definitely helps against the people who are all "the founding fathers were like this!" when they really don't bother to actually look shit up.
I know this is extremely reductionist, but for me the issue boils down to this: Can any U.S. Citizen that becomes incredibly ill be guaranteed quality medical care without fear financial ruin? If the answer is "no," then we are doing it wrong.
I know this is extremely reductionist, but for me the issue boils down to this: Can any U.S. Citizen that becomes incredibly ill be guaranteed quality medical care without fear financial ruin? If the answer is "no," then we are doing it wrong.
I hate to sound like the bad guy here, but I think that's a bit of an oversimplification. I support the requirement of employers to supply health insurance, but the work of a lot of physicians amounts to scientific miracles. I mean, you can use a gamma-knife to irradiate the exact dimensions of an inoperable malignant brain tumor and kill it outright with almost zero risk to the patient. There's a valid reason some of the services we offer in this country are out of the reach of even fairly good insurance coverage.
EDIT: Jesus Christ, I'm starting to sound like the older docs in my family...
Comments
My jaw hurts from dropping so much. Brits can just walk into a hospital, get treated, then walk out without having to pay a bill? You get compensated for bus or cab fare to the hospital? French people get a mandatory 5 weeks paid vacation? House call doctors still exist in France?
Have any of our British forumites seen the film and have they any comments or corrections?
The film goes to the best hospital where waiting lists are not really an issue and a doctor can spend more than 10 minutes with a patient. The NHS is by no means perfect as Moore makes out but it is still awesome that if I get ill or have an accident, I don't have to worry that I cannot afford the treatment that is going to make me better or my health insurance won't cover it. Oh and we have had this system since 1948.
EDIT: I may have some bias as I live in one of the more affluent areas of London where lots of the problems such as poor diet are not as big an issue.
I mean, christ, He can't even be honest about where he grew up - He talks up how he Grew up in Downtown Flint, Michigan, and builds his entire image around it - when in fact, he grew up in Davidson, Michigan, which is for all intents and purposes separate from Flint everywhere but on paper. It's an affluent and majority white area, filled with white-collar nuclear families. They're currently in the process of breaking away from Flint, and instead becoming a separate city in Davidson county.
And Let's not forget how he makes out like his old man was a factory worker at GM, when in reality, he was at white collar as the rest of the place he grew up - He did work in the factory - As the Factory Manager.
Waiting for medical care is an issue under every system, so let's just put that complaint to bed, okay?
Michael Moore is a Minister of Propaganda, not a documentarian.
It didn't work in the end, she just took the pills they threw at her and they turned her into an utter fucking mentalist, but when you have to game the system to get the treatment you need, when there are numerous cases of people getting purely cosmetic surgery paid for by the NHS, is just unforgiveable. True, the NHS does have it's upsides, but it's plagued by crippling problems, a labyrinth of paperwork and approvals to get treatment for anything more serious than a cold, and is generally a juggernaut of practically unparalleled bureaucracy.
@ Churba: While I agree with you on most his films, many financial experts from a variety of political backgrounds claim that "Capitalism: A Love Story" presents a lot of solid evidence. While they may disagree on the conclusions that Mr. Moore presents, the facts those conclusions are based on hold up.
I'm surprised he doesn't make himself sick with his own hypocrisy. I mean, Christ, he railed against corporations taking tax breaks in Capitalisim: a love story, and during the speaking tour for the film, also railed hard against Michigan's tax breaks for filmmakers, which can mean they actually receive more tax than they pay in Michigan while filming there. The very Same Tax break he applied for during the production of "Capitalisim: a love story", was approved for, and gladly took.
As for Facts he presents- I'm going to call Citation Needed on each and every one of them. Moore has a long history of changing, mis-representing, and outright fabricating the "Facts" he presents in his films.
American workers stay longer in the office, at the factory or on the farm than their counterparts in Europe and most other rich nations, and they produce more per person over the year.
They also get more done per hour than everyone but the Norwegians, according to a U.N. report released Monday, which said the United States "leads the world in labor productivity."
Each U.S. worker produces $63,885 of wealth per year, more than their counterparts in all other countries, the International Labor Organization said in its report. Ireland comes in second at $55,986, ahead of Luxembourg, $55,641; Belgium, $55,235; and France, $54,609.
-----------------
This productivity comes at a social cost. Who knows what the proper balance is. But we should at least recognize that our hard work pays off in terms of productivity.
One unfortunate reality is that, in certain professions, being a mother has an unescapable negative career impact. As much as we give lip service to women's rights, in many professions there is room for improvement. For example, certain segments of the legal profession are entirely incompatible with motherhood. The big firms expect you to work insane hours. This can't be done if you want to see your children when they are awake.
Whether you are a man or woman, I have always felt that the people who want to work as an associate in a big firm perversely value money over quality of life. I had a parent that went that route, and another parent that always maintained a good balance. Guess who was much happier in the end - and wasn't wanting for money, either.
This data was also collected before the financial collapse, so I'm doubting that it reflects the actual wealth of the nation. Lots of companies were overvaluing their assets so egregiously that they almost went out of business. That's got to wreak havok on those numbers, because it means the math in the study was done using FALSE reports.
I would argue that this isn't fully analogous to the current situation, but this definitely helps against the people who are all "the founding fathers were like this!" when they really don't bother to actually look shit up.
EDIT: Jesus Christ, I'm starting to sound like the older docs in my family...