Are there bad police in the world, yes, just like there are bad people in every career and field. Do police have the ability to have a greater affect on our life than the guy at Starbucks who does a bad job? Yes they do and they should be held to a high standard of conduct.
My point is simple, the vast majority of police are good, do good work, want to help people and I'll just be bringing some counter balance to all the negativity.
Once yet another black man is murdered, trying to balance the negativity with stories about police officers saving kittens isn't helpful. Most priests aren't pedophiles, but stories about priests helping people doesn't help balance the negativity of harm done by the few.
Once yet another black man is murdered, trying to balance the negativity with stories about police officers saving kittens isn't helpful. Most priests aren't pedophiles, but stories about priests helping people doesn't help balance the negativity of harm done by the few.
So we should judge whole groups of people based on the negative actions of a few members?
Also the police in the united states are, you know, responsible for upholding the quite racist criminal justice system and enforcing things like your drug laws, so even if an individual cop or cops were "good" they are still agents of a systemic evil so fuuuuuuuuuuck the police
Which is why black people in NYC are tens of times more likely to get stopped and frisked on the street than white people are... (To just give one counterexample)
That might have more to do with quotas and the city using the police has a revenue generating tool.
That doesn't make it not a racist system that officers are participating in.
No it doesn't, but it does change the root cause from "cops are racist and do these things because they are racist" to "cops may be racist and do these things because they want to keep their jobs."
I never said that cops-as-individuals were racist. I did imply that the institution of the police/justice system is racist, cuz it totally is, so even if your individual copmans don't have racist beliefs, they still uphold and perpetuate a racist system.
Is the system racist or is it being applied in a racist manner?
More the latter than the former. Profiling is supposed to be applied to behaviors not to protected statuses like race, gender, religion, or sexual preference.
In theory you're correct, but in practice profiling has always been applied to race, gender, religion, sexual preference, etc.
Considering the origins and history of many police forces (especially in the United States), I'm more inclined to say that racism is a core component of their policies and practices. It doesn't have to be, of course, (racism isn't intrinsic to the idea of policing) but we'd need some pretty huge changes to make our police forces modern, non-regressive organizations.
EDIT: So, technically both. Long-standing policies are super regressive, but there are also a lot of bigots, power-hungry assholes, and people whose split-second reactions show dangerous racial biases that they might not even be aware of.
No one would say "Fuck Police" if cops who killed/robbed/abused were punished even somewhat appropriately. As long as the system that police work within is so hideously broken, FUCK POLICE.
No one would say "Fuck Police" if cops who killed/robbed/abused were punished even somewhat appropriately. As long as the system that police work within is so hideously broken, FUCK POLICE.
This exactly. People like to bring up the fact that the vast majority of cops are good. That is partially true. That vast majority of police officers don't go shooting people for no reason, or using civil forfeiture to just straight up rob innocent people. They aren't actively beating people up for no reason, pepper spraying peaceful protests, or any of the other kinds of things you see in this thread.
But when was the last time you saw these so-called good police offers turn in their colleagues who are bad eggs? If they aren't actively ratting out and turning in the few officers who are bad, then they are complicit in their behavior and are therefore also bad. The same principle applies everywhere. If you see your friend shoplift something, and you keep your mouth shut, you're guilty!
In other words, you can count the number of truly good NYPD officers on one hand. The very few that have actually publicly brought attention to the corruption among their ranks are famous. Serpico, Schoolcraft, I think there was one or two more? That's how rare they are.
There was a This American Life episode on Schoolcraft. It's really fucked up how the other officers came after him so many times, often without even giving a reason for bringing him in.
One interesting thing is how the quota's aren't as simple as you think. Basically, crime in New York has dropped so much that they can't keep lowering crime at that rate, but it would make them look bad otherwise. So on the one hand they end up getting lots of bullshit arrests so it looks like they're still doing something, with the threat of reassignment and bad shifts if they don't. On the other many more serious crimes like rape are overlooked or downgraded to assault or robbery to make it look like the crime rate is lower than it is. They're actively going after innocent people while ignoring the real criminals because it's easier and makes them look better.
Yes, that's exactly right ninja rabbi. The NYPD feels a need to constantly report that crime is down, to prove that the work they do is actually making society better. So they underreport actually serious crimes.
But they also need to keep their jobs. If crime is so low, what do we need all these cops for? That's why they are all about anti-terrorist nonsense. It creates jobs for more cops. They also need to make it look like they are working hard and not sitting on heir asses, as well as generate revenues for themselves and the city. So they over enforce smaller crimes.
This is an institutional corruption problem, just like the problem of corruption in congress. But just because any individual person isn't directly corrupt, they are still participating in a corrupt system without fighting against it with all their might. Therefore they are perpetuating it, and are guilty of all its crimes.
What is the employment situation in the US? If someone with the skill-set of a police officer were to quit their job, could they find work which has similar remuneration?
One of the two reasons I stopped practising as a Veterinarian was that I identified the profession was shitty. Veterinarians are given more responsibility than Doctors and Pharmacists combined plus can certify any document. However I found a lot of Vets were disingenuous, misleading, uneducated and had poor morals. Every boss or person in power wanted me to lie to clients to make more money for the practice. So I stopped practising.
Is leaving your position as a police officer viable?
What is the employment situation in the US? If someone with the skill-set of a police officer were to quit their job, could they find work which has similar remuneration?
One of the two reasons I stopped practising as a Veterinarian was that I identified the profession was shitty. Veterinarians are given more responsibility than Doctors and Pharmacists combined plus can certify any document. However I found a lot of Vets were disingenuous, misleading, uneducated and had poor morals. Every boss or person in power wanted me to lie to clients to make more money for the practice. So I stopped practising.
Is leaving your position as a police officer viable?
Even if quitting being a police officer or whistleblowing corruption meant instant death, it's not an excuse. Doing the right thing in life always has negative consequences. That's why good people are usually courageous heroes. Being a coward isn't a valid excuse for being evil. Nothing is.
What is the employment situation in the US? If someone with the skill-set of a police officer were to quit their job, could they find work which has similar remuneration?
Is leaving your position as a police officer viable?
I'm a security officer and my partner is a former police officer from Cool Valley. He actually retired in the mid-2000's due to seeing the attitudes of new recruits firsthand, being the field training officer. Civilian security companies are always looking to snatch up cops and military vets as their skill sets translate well to what is needed in that sector. I'm sure a lot of big companies like Walmart, Target, and Meijer are also on the lookout for former police for their Loss Prevention departments.
Comments
Are there bad police in the world, yes, just like there are bad people in every career and field. Do police have the ability to have a greater affect on our life than the guy at Starbucks who does a bad job? Yes they do and they should be held to a high standard of conduct.
My point is simple, the vast majority of police are good, do good work, want to help people and I'll just be bringing some counter balance to all the negativity.
(To just give one counterexample)
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-york-city-lost-about-5-million-in-revenue-during-suspected-police-slowdown/
Considering the origins and history of many police forces (especially in the United States), I'm more inclined to say that racism is a core component of their policies and practices. It doesn't have to be, of course, (racism isn't intrinsic to the idea of policing) but we'd need some pretty huge changes to make our police forces modern, non-regressive organizations.
EDIT: So, technically both. Long-standing policies are super regressive, but there are also a lot of bigots, power-hungry assholes, and people whose split-second reactions show dangerous racial biases that they might not even be aware of.
But when was the last time you saw these so-called good police offers turn in their colleagues who are bad eggs? If they aren't actively ratting out and turning in the few officers who are bad, then they are complicit in their behavior and are therefore also bad. The same principle applies everywhere. If you see your friend shoplift something, and you keep your mouth shut, you're guilty!
In other words, you can count the number of truly good NYPD officers on one hand. The very few that have actually publicly brought attention to the corruption among their ranks are famous. Serpico, Schoolcraft, I think there was one or two more? That's how rare they are.
― Edmund Burke
Good people do not sit by while other people suffer.
One interesting thing is how the quota's aren't as simple as you think. Basically, crime in New York has dropped so much that they can't keep lowering crime at that rate, but it would make them look bad otherwise. So on the one hand they end up getting lots of bullshit arrests so it looks like they're still doing something, with the threat of reassignment and bad shifts if they don't. On the other many more serious crimes like rape are overlooked or downgraded to assault or robbery to make it look like the crime rate is lower than it is. They're actively going after innocent people while ignoring the real criminals because it's easier and makes them look better.
But they also need to keep their jobs. If crime is so low, what do we need all these cops for? That's why they are all about anti-terrorist nonsense. It creates jobs for more cops. They also need to make it look like they are working hard and not sitting on heir asses, as well as generate revenues for themselves and the city. So they over enforce smaller crimes.
This is an institutional corruption problem, just like the problem of corruption in congress. But just because any individual person isn't directly corrupt, they are still participating in a corrupt system without fighting against it with all their might. Therefore they are perpetuating it, and are guilty of all its crimes.
One of the two reasons I stopped practising as a Veterinarian was that I identified the profession was shitty. Veterinarians are given more responsibility than Doctors and Pharmacists combined plus can certify any document.
However I found a lot of Vets were disingenuous, misleading, uneducated and had poor morals. Every boss or person in power wanted me to lie to clients to make more money for the practice. So I stopped practising.
Is leaving your position as a police officer viable?