I think perhaps she didn't actually love him, but just wanted did it to piss her mom off and give a big middle finger to everyone else. And while he was crazy in love, he mostly just wanted his future to be "different" like he said at the beginning of the movie.
This was the point. She didn't give a fuck because she wanted to piss off her parents; he didn't because he was tired of being the same as everyone else. The ending is supposed to leave you uncertain of their future, or of what difference they've made, if any.
I just want to make it clear that I am only sharing these in response to Scott's comment and that this post is for entertainment purposes only. I'm not looking to start a gender war.
I know it's going to be something much more mundane, but I can't help but picture some dude lugging around a mass spectrometer, going "Hey baby, how you doin'?"
I think perhaps she didn't actually love him, but just wanted did it to piss her mom off and give a big middle finger to everyone else. And while he was crazy in love, he mostly just wanted his future to be "different" like he said at the beginning of the movie.
This was the point. She didn't give a fuck because she wanted to piss off her parents; he didn't because he was tired of being the same as everyone else. The ending is supposed to leave you uncertain of their future, or of what difference they've made, if any.
Yeah. And pretty much everything you hit on, Scott, was sort of the point of the whole thing and what you were supposed to get out of it. There's a sense of irrationality about their romance, and the last scene really reinforces that.
Yeah. And pretty much everything you hit on, Scott, was sort of the point of the whole thing and what you were supposed to get out of it. There's a sense of irrationality about their romance, and the last scene really reinforces that.
Well, I got it, but it's stupid. I generally just get frustrated with stories where people are so dumb. It's like watching someone playing Super Mario Bros. and walking into the first goomba over and over again without caring. You could play that on a loop with some music and call it art, maybe. I call it time to punch some sense into the person who can't figure out the jump button.
They're not supposed to be dumb. They're supposed to be trapped.
I don't know what you are thinking, but they are far from trapped. Dude just graduated college and has parents who can afford an in-ground pool. He can do almost anything he wants. Girl is hot and is in a similar situation, only hasn't graduated yet. They're in California, so they're not even trapped by the weather. That's the opposite of trapped.
They're not supposed to be dumb. They're supposed to be trapped.
I don't know what you are thinking, but they are far from trapped. Dude just graduated college and has parents who can afford an in-ground pool. He can do almost anything he wants. Girl is hot and is in a similar situation, only hasn't graduated yet. They're in California, so they're not even trapped by the weather. That's the opposite of trapped.
Scott, are you a robut? The point of the film is that you can't make choices when you don't know what you want. The protagonist is a kid who is expected to have everything figured out and his life mapped. He's always been successful because he was told what success was, and was pushed in all the right directions. Now that he has to stand on his own two feet, he's not sure anymore that he's sold on the American dream, or at least his parents' version of it. He feels adrift with no direction. He doesn't want to rely on his parents' money. He doesn't want their lives. The entire movie is filled with fetus and birth imagery (watch the pool scenes again), and it's because Ben needs to be born into his own future, not the one laid out for him.
I always know what I want. I can't really understand people who don't know what they want. How can you not know what you want? Even if you want something crazy, like to swim in a pool of jello on the moon, you must want something. If you really don't know what you want, you probably are better off doing what you are told. At least do something normal like running away and joining a circus or something, not becoming a stalker and fucking up other people's lives. At least the circus pays.
If you really don't know what you want, you probably are better off doing what you are told.
I whole-heartedly agree with this logic. I don't buy the excuse that not knowing what you want or how to get it means you have to be a drain on people around you and/or the system in general.
I have seen the following saying many times over the years, not sure from who it originated (from a list usually titled something like: Important Lessons about Life):
"Rule 9: Life is not divided into semesters. You don’t get summers off and very few employers are interested in helping you find yourself. Do that on your own time."
While trying to find that quote I stumbled across this other one:
“The work you find yourself doing while you’re procrastinating is probably the work you should be doing for the rest of your life.â€Â
Now if your goal is to be a drain on the system, to do nothing, or whatever, I'm actually more ok with that honesty and admission than some mopey emo hipster crap about taking half your life to decide what you are aiming to do.
*Edit: source of the life lessons quote is apparently Charles J. Sykes
I whole-heartedly agree with this logic. I don't buy the excuse that not knowing what you want or how to get it means you have to be a drain on people around you and/or the system in general.
You can not know what you want and not be a drain on the system and people around you. You can work a shit job while figuring out what you want from life.
I have seen the following saying many times over the years, not sure from who it originated (from a list usually titled something like: Important Lessons about Life):
"Rule 9: Life is not divided into semesters. You don’t get summers off and very few employers are interested in helping you find yourself. Do that on your own time."
Except it IS divided into years, and no one owns that time but you. Here's an idea: Fuck every existing list about "Rules for Life." You write that list for yourself. I'm taking a year off after I complete my undergrad. I have no idea what I'm going to do, how I'll make money, or who I'll meet. I consider this one of the better ideas I've had. Most people in the field that I'm aiming for (medicine) agree with me.
While trying to find that quote I stumbled across this other one:
“The work you find yourself doing while you’re procrastinating is probably the work you should be doing for the rest of your life.â€Â
That's defeatist, to my mind.
Now if your goal is to be a drain on the system, to do nothing, or whatever, I'm actually more ok with that honesty and admission than some mopey emo hipster crap about taking half your life to decide what you are aiming to do.
I don't even know what you're trying to say here. At least the latter actually intends to do something. For "logic," this sure doesn't make much fucking sense at all.
While trying to find that quote I stumbled across this other one:
“The work you find yourself doing while you’re procrastinating is probably the work you should be doing for the rest of your life.â€Â
Like the man with his cock in a bowl of pudding, I'm Fuckin' dis custard.
What a cowardly goddamn thing to hold one's life to. Were is the fuckin' fire in your belly? You have an eyeblink of a life, and a single one to live, and there is a world right out there, with an incredible series of events that have lead to every moment just there, ripe for you to burn like a magnesium flame, and instead, one thinks to light a single match saying "Well, If I'm doing this thing while I'm procrastinating, I should work with that for the rest of my life!"
GET FUCKED.
Literally and figuratively! (But don't expect us to wait for you to finish, wipe off and catch up, we don't have the time to wait) Have you ever thrown yourself from a plane and soared like a bird, or at least a mildly aerodynamic stone, with the enormity of the world beneath you, and the horizon a broad curve an infinity away? Have you been standing where you are the only man for a hundred miles and stared into the night sky to see the turn of the universe, knowing you're an infinitely small speck on an infinitely small speck, a tiny atom of a star system within a molecule of a galaxy among uncountable others. That molecule is a barely imaginably small part of what makes up something so mindbogglingly large that we are literally incapable of comprehending at this resolution, and you want to spend your life on what you do when you're procrastinating?
Shout it, right now, loud as you can so I know you're serious, FUCK THAT! FUCK that boring, tiny existence, FUCK that dead-ended nothing of comfortable wastage, FUCK knowing what comes tomorrow, FUCK dying, FUCK IT ALL!
If I had only moisture left in my mouth as I died left for a single swallow to ease my burning throat, I would spit it in the face of such a bullshit plan of boring, comfortable nothing and die with laughter on my lips! I want to grab you all by the hand and scream ALONSY! into the wind, and SEE EVERYTHING and DO EVERYTHING and BE everything until we all are gone like the blaze fireworks across the sky so large it makes the stationary bystanders wonder if it's legal. Love everyone you can love, see everything you can see, rise to the top only to rocket to the rock bottom like a meteor, and leave no stone unturned, and leave it all screaming with rage into the sky because there just isn't any more time. I will stand in the middle of it all, and watch the universe turn around me, with the nuclear fire of a billion billion suns glittering in my eyes, I will do every goddamned thing I can along the way and damned be to all who won't stand with me.
There is an infinite, uncountable, unfathomable, unimaginable universe out there, and a planet that none of us will ever live long enough to see enough of, and to waste it on something I'd do while I'm procrastinating? If you even have an iota of fire left in your veins, if even for a second your blood still cracks through your veins like lightning, waste your precious time with such cowardly, small notions. You've got a universe to explore.
I whole-heartedly agree with this logic. I don't buy the excuse that not knowing what you want or how to get it means you have to be a drain on people around you and/or the system in general.
You can not know what you want and not be a drain on the system and people around you. You can work a shit job while figuring out what you want from life.
I must not have succeeded in making it clear, but that is really the whole point I was trying to make. At least do something while you figure out what you really want to be doing.
“The work you find yourself doing while you’re procrastinating is probably the work you should be doing for the rest of your life.â€Â
That's defeatist, to my mind.
What a cowardly goddamn thing to hold one's life to.
I had a full time salaried job doing shit that people who weren't in the know thought was sweet because I had to frequently say "I can't tell you any more about that... national security." Yet while I procrastinated at work, or while I was at home procrastinating life itself (a.k.a. my free time), I found myself attempting to solve difficult math problems, studying emergent properties of systems, and playing board games with friends. Then I realized that is precisely what I should be doing, not being a code monkey of science for government agencies that wouldn't even use the information produced.
I quit my job and went into unemployment. I stayed there to pursue my own interests. Every one of those people I told that I was quitting my job without having a plan to pick up a new one, so that I could pursue my interests, said that I was brave and daring. This is quite the opposite of "defeatist" or "cowardly."
I am currently developing one tabletop roleplaying game with a friend and one card game, where I put to use all the things I just mentioned that I do when I was procrastinating. As I show people how development is coming along, I get a lot of positive responses that further encourage my decision. This is all in response to what I did when I was procrastinating, which is now what I do with my time.
I think WUB and Churba completely missed the point of the quote. I think it was saying that you should enjoy your work, because it takes up the majority of your waking life.
We've had this exact same discussion about Ethan Frome. That argument apparently doesn't fly around here.
The Ethan Frome argument is different; it's practically impossible for modern readers to really connect with the characters because their specific situation wouldn't happen today. The Graduate is effectively the same story, but it's more believable because people can more easily relate to the characters and their specific situation.
How can you not know what you want?
You can't know what you want in every context - this is why we need to experience things before we figure out what we really want.
You can't play before you play, and you can't write your paper before you gather your data.
You can't know what you want in every context - this is why we need to experience things before we figure out what we really want.
I can still feel a desire, even if that desire is actually wrong. I might not feel like eating a particular food, but then after I actually eat it I could realize that my desire was wrong. That food turned out to be exactly what I wanted.
What's fucked up is feeling no desire at all. Even more fucked up is doing things and then not knowing whether you enjoyed them.
It's not feeling no desire. When people say they "don't know what they want," what they mean is that their desire is complex and difficult to dissect. They need to gather more data.
It's not feeling no desire. When people say they "don't know what they want," what they mean is that their desire is complex and difficult to dissect. They need to gather more data.
I would hope they could gather data without unnecessary drama.
You can't know what you want in every context - this is why we need to experience things before we figure out what we really want.
You can't play before you play, and you can't write your paper before you gather your data.
We have the ability to use our brains to project possible reality; our imagination. This in combination with empathy with others and learning their stories yield your note about needing to personally experience things kind of moot.
I learned a lot of very hard life lessons by observing and counseling others. I did not have to learn these things by experiencing them for myself. I am not unique. Every human is capable of this.
I think WUB and Churba completely missed the point of the quote. I think it was saying that you should enjoy your work, because it takes up the majority of your waking life.
I took it as "the job you hold while you try to figure out what you want (procrastination) is the job you should hold forever." I would argue that the quote is poorly worded, or simply not worded in such a way that I could easily parse it into this argument. I do agree with your basic premise, though; you shouldn't be doing a job of you don't love it, or if it doesn't advance your goals.
I learned a lot of very hard life lessons by observing and counseling others. I did not have to learn these things by experiencing them for myself.
This works for some things, sure. I've observed my uncle destroy himself with heroin, so there's no need for me to repeat that process.
But there's a difference between knowing something and "knowing" something. A lot of lessons don't really kick in and cause behavioral change until they're been experienced personally.
While trying to find that quote I stumbled across this other one:
“The work you find yourself doing while you’re procrastinating is probably the work you should be doing for the rest of your life.â€Â
Like the man with his cock in a bowl of pudding, I'm Fuckin' dis custard.
When at college, and then at university, and then at my real jobs, I would procrastinate by juggling. Now I do that as a job. Have done for eight years now. It's treated me pretty well!
Now, when I'm meant to be practicing juggling, I find myself procrastinating by making music. Funnily enough, that's what I studied at university, and thought I would be doing for the rest of my life until I became a professional juggler. I'm currently working on a music and comedy show, to have as an option alongside my juggling and comedy show. Who knows, maybe the music will be more successful for me than the juggling?
So, I really liked that quote, because I like to think I do awesome things when I'm procrastinating. Most people do nothing more productive or useful than watching TV or playing video games, neither of which help much with a career in anything but TV or game journalism. In those cases, you should probably find a more interesting hobby.
Most people do nothing more productive or useful than watching TV or playing video games, neither of which help much with a career in anything but TV or game journalism.
I suppose I misunderstood the quote because I traditionally think of my procrastination activities as fun rather than work. However, if I take the quote for its true meaning, I daresay I'm doing pretty well in terms of my career goals. Most of my future work will involve joysticks and monitors, if everything goes alright. Also, systems architecture and biology, as well as medical device design, which are also a hobby of mine.
I think WUB and Churba completely missed the point of the quote. I think it was saying that you should enjoy your work, because it takes up the majority of your waking life.
I should have expected that, I've been around here long enough to know better. I'm genuinely disappointed. Oh well, moving swiftly on - I didn't say you don't work, hell, I spend a large amount of time working, though I had the luck to stumble my arse into a job-like-thing that dovetails nicely with my attitude - I mean, a few weeks apart, I got paid to go to the horse races, get drunk, and talk to people, then talk about that to other people, Go to a sex and lifestyle exhibition, and paid to captain a 42 foot cabin cruiser around for the better part of two days, while on top of that, I went and surfed a little to keep myself sharp, went to the theater, played some TF2, and investigated getting my SCUBA cert, both of which I might be able to leverage into a paying job later. You do what you do as a job, but do you not throw yourself into other things? Luke - who I'm actually genuinely surprised missed my point - turned his idle procrastination into a career, but does he not also explore the world in his travels, try to see things he has never seen before, and do things he hasn't tried before?
You still gotta work, because the world runs on money, and you will need at least some of it to carry out this sort of lifestyle - after all, one cannot live if one is spending all one's time working to survive. But what are you doing with it? Sure, you might not have a job as maddeningly variable as my freelancing, but surely it leads you to new things, and you find new experiences and places to go and see when you're not explicitly working?
I'll admit, I've got a little more fire in my belly than most - to me, stillness is death, and if you're not moving, you're not alive - but surely, on some level, you can't just be satisfied with working, flopping on the couch and watching some tv, maybe getting some takeaway from time to time, and then dying, just because you like your job? How can even the best job compare to even the world of the city in which you live, with all it's unexplored nooks, crannies, mysteries and wonders?
Comments
Related, women don't dig guys sporting high technology. That came up doing my search, thought it was amusing.
I just want to make it clear that I am only sharing these in response to Scott's comment and that this post is for entertainment purposes only. I'm not looking to start a gender war.
I have seen the following saying many times over the years, not sure from who it originated (from a list usually titled something like: Important Lessons about Life): While trying to find that quote I stumbled across this other one: Now if your goal is to be a drain on the system, to do nothing, or whatever, I'm actually more ok with that honesty and admission than some mopey emo hipster crap about taking half your life to decide what you are aiming to do.
*Edit: source of the life lessons quote is apparently Charles J. Sykes
What a cowardly goddamn thing to hold one's life to. Were is the fuckin' fire in your belly? You have an eyeblink of a life, and a single one to live, and there is a world right out there, with an incredible series of events that have lead to every moment just there, ripe for you to burn like a magnesium flame, and instead, one thinks to light a single match saying "Well, If I'm doing this thing while I'm procrastinating, I should work with that for the rest of my life!"
GET FUCKED.
Literally and figuratively! (But don't expect us to wait for you to finish, wipe off and catch up, we don't have the time to wait) Have you ever thrown yourself from a plane and soared like a bird, or at least a mildly aerodynamic stone, with the enormity of the world beneath you, and the horizon a broad curve an infinity away? Have you been standing where you are the only man for a hundred miles and stared into the night sky to see the turn of the universe, knowing you're an infinitely small speck on an infinitely small speck, a tiny atom of a star system within a molecule of a galaxy among uncountable others. That molecule is a barely imaginably small part of what makes up something so mindbogglingly large that we are literally incapable of comprehending at this resolution, and you want to spend your life on what you do when you're procrastinating?
Shout it, right now, loud as you can so I know you're serious, FUCK THAT! FUCK that boring, tiny existence, FUCK that dead-ended nothing of comfortable wastage, FUCK knowing what comes tomorrow, FUCK dying, FUCK IT ALL!
If I had only moisture left in my mouth as I died left for a single swallow to ease my burning throat, I would spit it in the face of such a bullshit plan of boring, comfortable nothing and die with laughter on my lips! I want to grab you all by the hand and scream ALONSY! into the wind, and SEE EVERYTHING and DO EVERYTHING and BE everything until we all are gone like the blaze fireworks across the sky so large it makes the stationary bystanders wonder if it's legal. Love everyone you can love, see everything you can see, rise to the top only to rocket to the rock bottom like a meteor, and leave no stone unturned, and leave it all screaming with rage into the sky because there just isn't any more time. I will stand in the middle of it all, and watch the universe turn around me, with the nuclear fire of a billion billion suns glittering in my eyes, I will do every goddamned thing I can along the way and damned be to all who won't stand with me.
There is an infinite, uncountable, unfathomable, unimaginable universe out there, and a planet that none of us will ever live long enough to see enough of, and to waste it on something I'd do while I'm procrastinating? If you even have an iota of fire left in your veins, if even for a second your blood still cracks through your veins like lightning, waste your precious time with such cowardly, small notions. You've got a universe to explore.
I quit my job and went into unemployment. I stayed there to pursue my own interests. Every one of those people I told that I was quitting my job without having a plan to pick up a new one, so that I could pursue my interests, said that I was brave and daring. This is quite the opposite of "defeatist" or "cowardly."
I am currently developing one tabletop roleplaying game with a friend and one card game, where I put to use all the things I just mentioned that I do when I was procrastinating. As I show people how development is coming along, I get a lot of positive responses that further encourage my decision. This is all in response to what I did when I was procrastinating, which is now what I do with my time.
I think WUB and Churba completely missed the point of the quote. I think it was saying that you should enjoy your work, because it takes up the majority of your waking life.
You can't play before you play, and you can't write your paper before you gather your data.
What's fucked up is feeling no desire at all. Even more fucked up is doing things and then not knowing whether you enjoyed them.
I learned a lot of very hard life lessons by observing and counseling others. I did not have to learn these things by experiencing them for myself. I am not unique. Every human is capable of this.
But there's a difference between knowing something and "knowing" something. A lot of lessons don't really kick in and cause behavioral change until they're been experienced personally.
I knew that I didn't want to end up doing contract work, because I knew I wanted a salaried job that would keep me stable for my entire life.
Then I realized I have ADD and/or wanderlust
Now, when I'm meant to be practicing juggling, I find myself procrastinating by making music. Funnily enough, that's what I studied at university, and thought I would be doing for the rest of my life until I became a professional juggler. I'm currently working on a music and comedy show, to have as an option alongside my juggling and comedy show. Who knows, maybe the music will be more successful for me than the juggling?
So, I really liked that quote, because I like to think I do awesome things when I'm procrastinating. Most people do nothing more productive or useful than watching TV or playing video games, neither of which help much with a career in anything but TV or game journalism. In those cases, you should probably find a more interesting hobby.
Luke - who I'm actually genuinely surprised missed my point - turned his idle procrastination into a career, but does he not also explore the world in his travels, try to see things he has never seen before, and do things he hasn't tried before?
You still gotta work, because the world runs on money, and you will need at least some of it to carry out this sort of lifestyle - after all, one cannot live if one is spending all one's time working to survive. But what are you doing with it? Sure, you might not have a job as maddeningly variable as my freelancing, but surely it leads you to new things, and you find new experiences and places to go and see when you're not explicitly working?
I'll admit, I've got a little more fire in my belly than most - to me, stillness is death, and if you're not moving, you're not alive - but surely, on some level, you can't just be satisfied with working, flopping on the couch and watching some tv, maybe getting some takeaway from time to time, and then dying, just because you like your job? How can even the best job compare to even the world of the city in which you live, with all it's unexplored nooks, crannies, mysteries and wonders?