I'm not butthurt. I'm just equating rape statistics with other crime statistics and finding some parallels between differing demographics. If it's not misandry then it's not racism either and it's certainly your prerogative not to be bothered by the similarities.
Big difference: Racial minorities and women share the shit end of the kyriarchy stick. White folk acting scared of racial minorities contributes to the stuff that keeps those minorities in poverty which is what causes those crime statistics because it turns out the actual causation is poverty and when you run crime rates against that you get similar numbers across all demographics.
On the flip end, women don't get raped because women discriminate against men thus causing men to enter into a situation where, when compared to women in the same situation, they rape a similar number of people. No, women get raped because men rape them, and women are scared of and discriminate against men because a lot of us are rapists.
Sorry, but all signs are currently pointing towards you being a racist, misogynistic piece of shit. I think I'm done with you.
Big difference: Racial minorities and women share the shit end of the kyriarchy stick. White folk acting scared of racial minorities contributes to the stuff that keeps those minorities in poverty which is what causes those crime statistics because it turns out the actual causation is poverty and when you run crime rates against that you get similar numbers across all demographics.
On the flip end, women don't get raped because women discriminate against men thus causing men to enter into a situation where, when compared to women in the same situation, they rape a similar number of people. No, women get raped because men rape them, and women are scared of and discriminate against men because a lot of us are rapists.
White privilege has nothing to do with the bare likelihood of a black man committing a violent crime given the opportunity.
Yes, white privilege is responsible for their societal position, to a very large extent, but when you're talking about walking down a dark street and having a reasonable fear of someone behind, you, based on statistics, then the two most certainly are equatable. Justifications and rationales are tangential.
Muppet, the two feelings are incredibly different. I've been followed down the street by gangbangers, and I've been creeped on by scary dudes in bars. While the latter doesn't come close to what I imagine most women deal with on a regular (if not daily) basis, it's much worse than the former.
EDIT: The dudes in question were creepy old drunk men. The best phrase I can come up with to describe their behavior would be "aggressive insistence," because they continue even after a firm "no, go away." It's really uncomfortable.
I'm trying to find it but I read a statistic that while yes, black people are more likely to commit a crime against white people than the reverse, most crimes committed by a black person are in fact against another black person. Again it comes back to who is closer to you, considering an acquaintance is more likely to rape someone than a stranger. But hang on let me cite my shit.
No I didn't. I said that there is a hypothetical, potential alternate interpretation of some of the stuff in her account that makes it reasonable to want to hear both sides. If she was as clear as she says then there's no question he's at fault, but the account has some oddities, like the cat defense. If you equate that sort of analysis and desire for more details with victim blaming then I don't think you're being rational.
No I didn't. I said that there is a hypothetical, potential alternate interpretation of some of the stuff in her account that makes it reasonable to want to hear both sides. If she was as clear as she says then there's no question he's at fault, but the account has some oddities, like the cat defense. If you equate that sort of analysis and desire for more details with victim blaming then I don't think you're being rational.
I dunno, putting up an animal that as far as we know still had claws and teeth, and with said claws and teeth likely pointed at the guy, which has no loyalty to the guy whatsoever (although questionable loyalty to its owner) should make it pretty clear that you should back off or prepare to be attacked.
I'm not butthurt. I'm just equating rape statistics with other crime statistics and finding some parallels between differing demographics. If it's not misandry then it's not racism either and it's certainly your prerogative not to be bothered by the similarities.
I'm perfectly aware of the conundrum of the "being afraid of black people" situation. I'm in Atlanta, where there is a large proportion of black people compared to other large cities. I also went to Georgia Tech, where there are lots of prime targets that carry around laptops, iPhones, etc. During this time we got tons of notices that people had been attacked on the outskirts of campus. The descriptions of the perpetrators were all of tall black men in baggy clothes. This obviously made everyone nervous.
So I thought about this a lot. If I ever found myself in a non-heavily populated area and a tall black man with baggy clothes were to approach or follow me, I might panic and run or get my phone ready to call the police, etc... The results are: If I don't get attacked, I'm a fucking racist. If I do get attacked, I'm fucking stupid and its my fault for not staying away from someone who fit the description of a crime suspect. I hate this conundrum because both outcomes are bad, but there is no other option. So when you compare this to women being afraid of men in general, it really makes me just as angry. (Fun fact, I have been approached by at least 1 strange man that I truly sensed meant me harm, however I was lucky enough to get away, and I've also been blatantly followed/stalked, and was again lucky enough to get away).
And by the way, I get paranoid around all unknown men in sketchy situations, not a certain kind (aka I'm not racist if that's what you're going for). Actually in unfamiliar situations I'm pretty cautious around everyone, even women. You better believe I have an iron grip on my purse.
Anyway so when it comes down to it, I value my safety over your feelings. Don't know why any of us are arguing anymore, its obvious you think women are sick and terrible for being cautious around unknown men and nothing will change your mind.
If you think that's obvious then you are projecting an awful lot onto my posts that simply isn't in them. I don't think that at all, but I DO think that divisive hysterics are extremely counterproductive to society in general.
After reading that, I can't help but feel some of the tone was based on some horrible experiences in the past. Certainly the guy is a manipulative bastard, and the whole naked thing is weird. But I just think that what he did may have been drudging up some horrible memories and making what happened seem even worse. Its definitely harassment, but I don't know if its really abuse.
As for the whole "men are rapists" thing, I know how that feels. I'm always conscious when I happen to be walking in the same direction as some girl and often try not to o the same way so that its not assumed that I'm following her. Sometimes I can't help but feel like a creeper for no apparent reason.
You know that whole flirty "no" thing pisses me off. I'm in now way blaming the victim, but I am partially blaming these other girls that say no in a flirty way to guys and then end up going home with them. They're part of the problem. While to someone with good flirting skills its not that hard to tell the difference , not all guys see it that way. That shit socializes guys into the "she was asking for it" mentality. Its still the rapists fault no matter what, but saying no in a flirty way is just encouraging guys to become more aggressive in their advances.
Also, the few girls who DO falsely accuse men of rape are total shitbags. Not just because it sucks for the guy, but mainly because they create the stereotype of girls lying about rape and make it hard for the many real victims to seek help. Girls like that aren't just fucking over their ex-boyfriend or whoever they're pissed at, they're hurting every girl who's ever been raped and is afraid to do something about it. God this shit pisses me off.
At the current time I can't find anything on the internet to substantiate my claims, and a whole lot of stuff saying that's bullshit perpetrated by conservatives to justify their prejudices. But it does make a little sense, after all if we all stick to our own little communities where do you think the most crime is gonna happen, and against who?
Though that socially awkward penguin brings up an interesting question I have: Is it now a man's duty to ensure he doesn't look like a rapist, or should it be enough that women just practice due diligence?
I think that it's reasonable for men to try to avoid putting women in uncomfortable situations providing we don't go overboard in either direction. Just like, don't get in the elevator alone with them, keep your hands visible, reasonable little things like that.
I usually go by "Don't be a dick." which generally includes trying not to look like a rapist. Also, I try to control things that I can control rather than wanting other people to do their due diligence.
For example, I drive defensively rather than hoping others drive sanely.
I'm a bit of a hypocrite though since I don't have a CCW and fully allow the police to do their jobs. I also rely on the fire department to put me out if I'm on fire in my house.
As for the whole "men are rapists" thing, I know how that feels. I'm always conscious when I happen to be walking in the same direction as some girl and often try not to o the same way so that its not assumed that I'm following her. Sometimes I can't help but feel like a creeper for no apparent reason.
As for the whole "men are rapists" thing, I know how that feels. I'm always conscious when I happen to be walking in the same direction as some girl and often try not to o the same way so that its not assumed that I'm following her. Sometimes I can't help but feel like a creeper for no apparent reason.
Dude, wait: Do you think this leather fetish mask I wear whenever I take the subway at night is off-putting? I just wear it for warmth, but I guess people might not like it.
As for the whole "men are rapists" thing, I know how that feels. I'm always conscious when I happen to be walking in the same direction as some girl and often try not to o the same way so that its not assumed that I'm following her. Sometimes I can't help but feel like a creeper for no apparent reason.
That still comes down to telling one demographic to change their behavior to accommodate another demographic's (mostly justified) fears.
And is there a problem with that? We might want to touch the glowing red shiny hot thing on the stove, but we realize that it will be a problem to continually touch it. We don't demand that it stop being hot so we can touch it.
Sometimes as we grow older we learn things that change our perspective and challenge how we should act. So, as human beings, we adjust how we react to certain situations to better accommodate others.
As for the whole "men are rapists" thing, I know how that feels. I'm always conscious when I happen to be walking in the same direction as some girl and often try not to o the same way so that its not assumed that I'm following her. Sometimes I can't help but feel like a creeper for no apparent reason.
Most of those I feel like are general sidewalk things. I hate when people walk really close behind me, but I'm usually more concerned with them mugging me.
As for the whole "men are rapists" thing, I know how that feels. I'm always conscious when I happen to be walking in the same direction as some girl and often try not to o the same way so that its not assumed that I'm following her. Sometimes I can't help but feel like a creeper for no apparent reason.
That still comes down to telling one demographic to change their behavior to accommodate another demographic's (mostly justified) fears.
Considering that the decks are (rightfully) stacked against men, though, that's kind of to be expected. The simple fact of the matter here is that it's not equal, because a horrifying number of men still rape women. There are women who go objectively too far, and make a point of making men feel bad about being men, but I don't think this article is unreasonable at all. If anything, it's common sense to actively try not to be a threatening presence on the street, the situation where it's dark and you're the person on the street save for a woman or two only exacerbating the issue.
I think that it's reasonable for men to try to avoid putting women in uncomfortable situations providing we don't go overboard in either direction. Just like, don't get in the elevator alone with them, keep your hands visible, reasonable little things like that.
While I agree with the sentiment that people should avoid creating situations where they make people severely uncomfortable. Both your examples are absurd. So I should never get in an elevator if it happens to have a lone woman already in it or put my hands in my pockets in public? Nuri's link is good, but pretty much everything there is "be a normal, casual, and polite person".
Dude, wait: Do you think this leather fetish mask I wear whenever I take the subway at night is off-putting? I just wear it for warmth, but I guess people might not like it.
I definitely have the problem of walking a lot faster than the average female (and most males). I don't mean to spook anyone, but I'm not gonna walk slow to make people less uncomfortable. Good advice on announcing my presence I suppose.
99% of the time, you are just fine if you are being a normal, casual person and treating the woman as you would treat anyone (assuming you are not a giant asshole). The troubling behavior is when a guy starts to act weird: showing unusual interest, acting like a mentally unstable person, behaving as if touching or getting attention from a woman is his right, etc.
Basically, the rules of interacting with any person, male or female. Don't be a dick. No one owes you a conversation, a hug, or a BJ. Let them engage on their own terms.
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On the flip end, women don't get raped because women discriminate against men thus causing men to enter into a situation where, when compared to women in the same situation, they rape a similar number of people. No, women get raped because men rape them, and women are scared of and discriminate against men because a lot of us are rapists.
Sorry, but all signs are currently pointing towards you being a racist, misogynistic piece of shit. I think I'm done with you.
Yes, white privilege is responsible for their societal position, to a very large extent, but when you're talking about walking down a dark street and having a reasonable fear of someone behind, you, based on statistics, then the two most certainly are equatable. Justifications and rationales are tangential.
EDIT: The dudes in question were creepy old drunk men. The best phrase I can come up with to describe their behavior would be "aggressive insistence," because they continue even after a firm "no, go away." It's really uncomfortable.
So I thought about this a lot. If I ever found myself in a non-heavily populated area and a tall black man with baggy clothes were to approach or follow me, I might panic and run or get my phone ready to call the police, etc... The results are: If I don't get attacked, I'm a fucking racist. If I do get attacked, I'm fucking stupid and its my fault for not staying away from someone who fit the description of a crime suspect. I hate this conundrum because both outcomes are bad, but there is no other option. So when you compare this to women being afraid of men in general, it really makes me just as angry. (Fun fact, I have been approached by at least 1 strange man that I truly sensed meant me harm, however I was lucky enough to get away, and I've also been blatantly followed/stalked, and was again lucky enough to get away).
And by the way, I get paranoid around all unknown men in sketchy situations, not a certain kind (aka I'm not racist if that's what you're going for). Actually in unfamiliar situations I'm pretty cautious around everyone, even women. You better believe I have an iron grip on my purse.
Anyway so when it comes down to it, I value my safety over your feelings. Don't know why any of us are arguing anymore, its obvious you think women are sick and terrible for being cautious around unknown men and nothing will change your mind.
As for the whole "men are rapists" thing, I know how that feels. I'm always conscious when I happen to be walking in the same direction as some girl and often try not to o the same way so that its not assumed that I'm following her. Sometimes I can't help but feel like a creeper for no apparent reason.
You know that whole flirty "no" thing pisses me off. I'm in now way blaming the victim, but I am partially blaming these other girls that say no in a flirty way to guys and then end up going home with them. They're part of the problem. While to someone with good flirting skills its not that hard to tell the difference , not all guys see it that way. That shit socializes guys into the "she was asking for it" mentality. Its still the rapists fault no matter what, but saying no in a flirty way is just encouraging guys to become more aggressive in their advances.
Also, the few girls who DO falsely accuse men of rape are total shitbags. Not just because it sucks for the guy, but mainly because they create the stereotype of girls lying about rape and make it hard for the many real victims to seek help. Girls like that aren't just fucking over their ex-boyfriend or whoever they're pissed at, they're hurting every girl who's ever been raped and is afraid to do something about it. God this shit pisses me off.
For example, I drive defensively rather than hoping others drive sanely.
I'm a bit of a hypocrite though since I don't have a CCW and fully allow the police to do their jobs. I also rely on the fire department to put me out if I'm on fire in my house.
Sometimes as we grow older we learn things that change our perspective and challenge how we should act. So, as human beings, we adjust how we react to certain situations to better accommodate others.
Most of those I feel like are general sidewalk things. I hate when people walk really close behind me, but I'm usually more concerned with them mugging me.
Nuri's link is good, but pretty much everything there is "be a normal, casual, and polite person".
Basically, the rules of interacting with any person, male or female. Don't be a dick. No one owes you a conversation, a hug, or a BJ. Let them engage on their own terms.