Checking in from time to time is my idea of sticking to my ideals and canvasing for my candidate, don't start thinking I've got a crush on you or anything.
Bitching on the internet to people who don't listen or care what you say is activism. Welcome to 2016, ladies and gents.
(Some) People on this forum like Bernie, muppet. People on this forum are just tired of hearing you talk about how awful the Clinton presidency would be, because the evidence to support it is lackluster.
No, I don't like her either. No, I don't trust her. I also don't trust Obama, or most politicians. They also successfully run our country in ways the Republicans don't, so...Yeah.
In 1968 a lot of youth vote dropped out of the electorate after Bobby Kennedy's assassination, even more after Humphry's nomination, because no candidate was running on a peace platform. The margin between Humphry and Nixon was so narrow that, had the Yippies voted for Humphry, it would have changed the outcome. Instead, we got Kent State, Watergate, and five more years of Vietnam.
Those who don't learn from history are doomed to fuck shit up for the rest of us.
Churba you can keep on calling consistency the same old song and dance and maybe that plays to your audience but it's not much of an argument. I could accuse you of the same thing. The same condescending, loosely backed arguments that rely on force of personality over any strength in your citations (when you give them.)
Checking in from time to time is my idea of sticking to my ideals and canvasing for my candidate, don't start thinking I've got a crush on you or anything.
Crem - he's definitely still an underdog, but both demographics in upcoming states (and I'm not talking about "whiteness") and spreading awareness are working in his favor right now, in a big way.
Greg, it's sad that you think standing up for integrity in governance is trolling. Sorry to hear. Also apparently I'm a Bernie Bro (which doesn't actually exist outside of a construct of the Hillary campaign, you should see the hate mail I get from HRC supporters on my Bernie page) because I believe in it. That's an unfortunate stance, too.
There are acid, horrible supporters of every candidate. I've seen it from "Bernie People", but not on my page almost ever. When I do, I ask them to use good arguments and not juvenile nonsense. I've seen far more of it on Hillary pages and in the trolling comments of Hillary supporters on more popular venues. You could accuse me of cognitive filtering and I could accuse you of the same. It's out there in any shape or form you want to find it in.
I found this a pretty interesting argument, which I'm sure many here will dismiss as "He won't do those things anyway.":
I can certainly relate to this as we have a two income middle class household in Connecticut and my Crohns Disease has now gone untreated for 3 years because I simply can't afford to pay for my prescriptions anymore and still cover my kids' needs as well. It's either/or for us at this point. Hillary's not going to fix that. She's not even going to talk about fixing that. In fact she's already come out and said that it can't happen.
Lucky for me it's just a slow, somewhat painful progression and not something really aggressive like cancer that I can't afford the meds for (Not yet anyway. Untreated Crohns tends to inevitably become colorectal cancer, which has a terrible mortality rate). Others have it a lot worse (and have been ejected from all sorts of places trying to be heard about it, and recently.)
Too bad the Hillary campaign hasn't got any photos of Sanders looking super Jewy they can circulate, I guess. That sort of thing seems to be all right.
One of my friends on Facebook posted a link to this article. This was my response to him:
Mr. Brasunas’ article here is ill-formed and not grounded in fundamental civics. Of course people would be better off with a $15 minimum wage as opposed to $12, or universal healthcare, or free college tuition. What is unrealistic is to think that will happen in 4 years or 8 years under a President Sanders.
The practice of governance in a democracy of competing ideologies is about making deals, it's about compromise, and the complicit understanding that getting half a loaf today and fighting for more tomorrow is better than going hungry. The perfect is the enemy of the good, and the good is better than nothing. Getting a law passed is harder than trying to herd cats, and is made impossible when your own constituency does not appreciate statesmanship. Bernie Sanders doesn't compromise. He just keeps yelling and yelling and eventually his legislation dies and doesn't get passed. Yay for ideological purity! In order to pass successful legislation, you need to have allies in Congress, you have to make deals and play the quid pro quo game. It is a long game with an infinite score and to play you need to let all the players occasionally have something to go home with. There is no way that Congress is going to pass any of Bernie's proposals, just like there is no way that the ideological purists of the Right will ever get their way either. Bernie is an Independent with no network or political allies.
Mr. Brasunas is being disingenuous when he writes "Bernie Sanders’s proposals, many of which are quite bold, are not all guaranteed to be immediately implemented of course, but Bernie has a long track record of tenacity and passing progressive legislation even in Republican-controlled legislatures.” According to govtrack.us, Bernie Sanders has sponsored 362 bills while in Congress. Only 7 have been enacted. And out of those 7 bills actually signed into law, 5 of them deal exclusively with Vermont. That’s not my opinion, that’s facts.
Further, given that Mr. Sanders is an independent without a network of allies in Congress to support his legislation, his “admittedly bold proposals” aren't going to be implemented immediately or at all, especially in the current do-nothing Republican-controlled legislatures. Even if Congress was Democrat-controlled, he'd still have immense problems. Obama had both the Senate and the House for two years and look how hard it was for him to pass the ACA. He had to make backroom deals, he had to make compromises. Take things out he cared about and put things in he hated. A President Sanders wouldn't do any of that. He'd stick to his ideological purity and his legislative agenda would fail. Half a loaf is better than starving to death without medical care though, and the ACA is now being signaled as a crowning achievement, warts and all.
Personally as a progressive I honestly and truly wish that every one of Mr. Sanders proposals would be passed but unfortunately, Bernie Sanders is not the president to do it. He's is a fantastic ideologue who can help usher in a new progressive bent to the Democratic party that is desperately needed, but he is not a leader, he's a yeller. A leader supports and grows his or her movement. Bernie has never done any of that. He's been in Congress for 30 years and he hasn't tried to start a progressive wing of the Democratic party. He’d rather be an Independent by himself than actually try to build support as a Democrat. By contrast, look at what Elizabeth Warren has been able to do and she hasn’t even had one full term in the Senate yet. He hasn't supported or campaigned for any politician who has similar views. He's one lone guy who after being in politics for decades suddenly wants a "revolution" to happen. But in order for a revolution within a democracy to occur, you have to have done work to nurture it. Bernie hasn't done any of that. His legislative record is a perfect example of this. He sponsors great laws that I’d love to see passed, but they don’t.
So, back to the article, of course people would prefer $15 over $12, but if you asked them, would they prefer a somewhat more realistic $12 over nothing? They would say yes. Same with health care. The ACA is far from perfect, but it's a step in the right direction. Of course most progressives want universal healthcare or a single payer system but they're not going to get it anytime soon. By contrast, ask the 20 million people who now have healthcare because of the ACA if they're happier now than before.
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Some change, even if it's not fully what we want is better than no change at all.
Additionally, I am tired of articles about politics from people who have no idea what they're talking about. Tony Brasunas has no background in political science. He majored in Computer Science at Amherst and wrote a book about meditation. He works as a software engineer in San Francisco.
How does his major or writing a book about mediation prove that he doesn't know how government works? I mean, I'm not saying you're wrong, but that's coming off a bit poison-the-well-y. I'm a CS major; does that mean that my opinions on government have no validity?
Bitching on the internet to people who don't listen or care what you say is activism. Welcome to 2016, ladies and gents.
Against my better judgement, I'm going to disagree with your sentiment here. This forum has voters in it, some of whom muppet may be able to sway over to his side, via bitching.
What would you have him do in the name of activism? Man telephones? Go out on the street with a sign? Run for public office? In 2016, bitching on the internet might be one of the more effective things you can do, if your goal is getting votes.
Full disclosure: I'm a punk kid who realizes he may have no idea what he's talking about. I'm not looking to get into a fight. If you disagree with me, just politely inform me why I'm wrong, and I'll listen.
How does his major or writing a book about mediation prove that he doesn't know how government works? I mean, I'm not saying you're wrong, but that's coming off a bit poison-the-well-y. I'm a CS major; does that mean that my opinions on government have no validity?
True, I may be a bit hyperbolic in my post, but at the same time, someone somewhere thought he was qualified to write about politics. Why?
In my ideal world, and maybe this is just me, but if you're going to write about something, you should have some knowledge about it before you start spouting off about this or that. He should have some credentials. The fact that people take him seriously when he doesn't appear to have any credentials about politics is something I disagree with and it worries me. You have people like Muppet and other Bernie Sanders supporters taking what he says seriously without applying any critical reasoning to what he said.
I think climate change is a real thing. I think everyone should try to stop it. The US should pass a Carbon Tax. However, I have absolutely no science background. Who knows how much or how little I actually know about climate change or science at all. People shouldn't put any weight in my opinions. A website should not let me write about climate change.
Sanders presidency: little short-term change. slim possibility of long-term improvement. Clinton presidency: little short-term change. slim possibility of long-term damage. Trump presidency: immediate harm to minorities and women.
If you need a degree to have an opinion then I guess I have to quit politics.
There is a difference between having an opinion and having your own column. I guess that's my point.
Medium's just a site. Anyone can post there.
My bad, I didn't know that. I thought it was like Salon or Slate or something like that. That almost makes it worse though.
If there is one thing our government relies on, it's the fact the citizenship and the right to hold and espouse a political stance does not require economic, academic, or social status. The fact that you are bothered that someone can post a political opinion for people to see really does not help your position.
If you need a degree to have an opinion then I guess I have to quit politics.
There is a difference between having an opinion and having your own column. I guess that's my point.
My grandfather never went to college. He became an author of 17 (18?) books, a political organizer, and one of the original correspondents on 60 Minutes. Was it wrong for him to have a column for several decades?
If you need a degree to have an opinion then I guess I have to quit politics.
There is a difference between having an opinion and having your own column. I guess that's my point.
Medium's just a site. Anyone can post there.
My bad, I didn't know that. I thought it was like Salon or Slate or something like that. That almost makes it worse though.
If there is one thing our government relies on, it's the fact the citizenship and the right to hold and espouse a political stance does not require economic, academic, or social status. The fact that you are bothered that someone can post a political opinion for people to see really does not help your position.
I guess I'm more bothered that people would give his opinion substantial weight without looking into his background. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and they're also entitled to espouse it, but not all opinions are created equally. Instead of just linking to an article by anyone, people should first do a bit of research as to who the author is. In this day and age, when that's so easy, that just makes it worse when they don't. One of the great things about this forum is that unless you provide links to back up what you say, not many people will take you seriously. That's why I linked to Senator Sander's legislative record. You shouldn't take my word that he's only passed 7 bills, but if I link to a reputable source, that means something.
Greg, to address your point, I don't know anything about your grandfather. I have no idea what he did or how he learned about politics despite not having gone to college. From what little you just wrote, he certainly seems impressive. That being said, if I heard his opinion, because he doesn't have the formal credentials I would normally look for, I would (hopefully) do some background research of my own to see if his opinion was backed up by facts. The more it was, the more I would tend to agree with him and a relationship of trust would be built up over time. In Tony Brasunas's case, he also lacks the formal credentials. Not only that, but what he wrote shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how government works. When you combine those things, it means that his opinion doesn't warrant merit.
If you need a degree to have an opinion then I guess I have to quit politics.
We could get together and form an apolitical jam group performing in character as figures from political history around the world. On Guitar, Andrew "The Duelist" Jackson, on Drums, Harold "Quick Swim" Holt, on Bass, George "6-foot-8 weighs a fucking ton" Washington.
If you need a degree to have an opinion then I guess I have to quit politics.
We could get together and form an apolitical jam group performing in character as figures from political history around the world. On Guitar, Andrew "The Duelist" Jackson, on Drums, Harold "Quick Swim" Holt, on Bass, George "6-foot-8 weighs a fucking ton" Washington.
Once upon a time I wanted to form a group called John Quincy Adams and the Mole People (because this) so that I could tour on a bill with Andrew Jackson Jihad and Henry Clay People and we would call it the Election of 1824 Tour. Sadly Andrew Jackson Jihad has changed their name to AJJ and Henry Clay People disbanded.
The Trump world just gets worse and worse the more it continues on. The newest being "Women should be punished for getting the abortions, but the men who impregnate women she be forgiven from crimes." Plus when people ask about riots at Trump riots, supporters will immediately go to "Oh, those are just Hilary Supporters causing a ruckus because George Soros of MoveOn.org is evil."
Romney and Ryan weaker candidates than Trump. I didn't think either of them were viable candidates, but to have worse margins than Trump says something frightening about the electorate.
Latest Anti-Bernie conspiracy out of the right wing is that he bought an Audi R8 with donor money. While I can't fault his taste if he had, needless to say, it's absolutely not true.
I'm so angry at this type of shit and this is a rather progressive school. It is in the only county of the state that voted for Bernie Sanders over Clinton in the Democratic Primary. What's irritating is too many people assuming that it was probably done by a Trump hater as a set up and that it isn't that disgraceful since everyone paints on that rock.
For real? Less than 15k invested in a mutual fund, 5% of which is invested in another fund, 1.5% of which is invested in an oil company. At most that's... 11 bucks.
Comments
No, I don't like her either. No, I don't trust her. I also don't trust Obama, or most politicians. They also successfully run our country in ways the Republicans don't, so...Yeah.
Clinton presidency: little short-term change.
Trump presidency: immediate harm to minorities and women.
Those who don't learn from history are doomed to fuck shit up for the rest of us.
Mr. Brasunas’ article here is ill-formed and not grounded in fundamental civics. Of course people would be better off with a $15 minimum wage as opposed to $12, or universal healthcare, or free college tuition. What is unrealistic is to think that will happen in 4 years or 8 years under a President Sanders.
The practice of governance in a democracy of competing ideologies is about making deals, it's about compromise, and the complicit understanding that getting half a loaf today and fighting for more tomorrow is better than going hungry. The perfect is the enemy of the good, and the good is better than nothing. Getting a law passed is harder than trying to herd cats, and is made impossible when your own constituency does not appreciate statesmanship. Bernie Sanders doesn't compromise. He just keeps yelling and yelling and eventually his legislation dies and doesn't get passed. Yay for ideological purity! In order to pass successful legislation, you need to have allies in Congress, you have to make deals and play the quid pro quo game. It is a long game with an infinite score and to play you need to let all the players occasionally have something to go home with. There is no way that Congress is going to pass any of Bernie's proposals, just like there is no way that the ideological purists of the Right will ever get their way either. Bernie is an Independent with no network or political allies.
Mr. Brasunas is being disingenuous when he writes "Bernie Sanders’s proposals, many of which are quite bold, are not all guaranteed to be immediately implemented of course, but Bernie has a long track record of tenacity and passing progressive legislation even in Republican-controlled legislatures.” According to govtrack.us, Bernie Sanders has sponsored 362 bills while in Congress. Only 7 have been enacted. And out of those 7 bills actually signed into law, 5 of them deal exclusively with Vermont. That’s not my opinion, that’s facts.
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/browse...
Further, given that Mr. Sanders is an independent without a network of allies in Congress to support his legislation, his “admittedly bold proposals” aren't going to be implemented immediately or at all, especially in the current do-nothing Republican-controlled legislatures. Even if Congress was Democrat-controlled, he'd still have immense problems. Obama had both the Senate and the House for two years and look how hard it was for him to pass the ACA. He had to make backroom deals, he had to make compromises. Take things out he cared about and put things in he hated. A President Sanders wouldn't do any of that. He'd stick to his ideological purity and his legislative agenda would fail. Half a loaf is better than starving to death without medical care though, and the ACA is now being signaled as a crowning achievement, warts and all.
Personally as a progressive I honestly and truly wish that every one of Mr. Sanders proposals would be passed but unfortunately, Bernie Sanders is not the president to do it. He's is a fantastic ideologue who can help usher in a new progressive bent to the Democratic party that is desperately needed, but he is not a leader, he's a yeller. A leader supports and grows his or her movement. Bernie has never done any of that. He's been in Congress for 30 years and he hasn't tried to start a progressive wing of the Democratic party. He’d rather be an Independent by himself than actually try to build support as a Democrat. By contrast, look at what Elizabeth Warren has been able to do and she hasn’t even had one full term in the Senate yet. He hasn't supported or campaigned for any politician who has similar views. He's one lone guy who after being in politics for decades suddenly wants a "revolution" to happen. But in order for a revolution within a democracy to occur, you have to have done work to nurture it. Bernie hasn't done any of that. His legislative record is a perfect example of this. He sponsors great laws that I’d love to see passed, but they don’t.
So, back to the article, of course people would prefer $15 over $12, but if you asked them, would they prefer a somewhat more realistic $12 over nothing? They would say yes. Same with health care. The ACA is far from perfect, but it's a step in the right direction. Of course most progressives want universal healthcare or a single payer system but they're not going to get it anytime soon. By contrast, ask the 20 million people who now have healthcare because of the ACA if they're happier now than before.
The perfect is the enemy of the good. Some change, even if it's not fully what we want is better than no change at all.
To think otherwise is privilege.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/tonybrasunas
Why he has his own opinion piece about politics when it's clear he has no idea how government actually works is beyond me.
What would you have him do in the name of activism? Man telephones? Go out on the street with a sign? Run for public office? In 2016, bitching on the internet might be one of the more effective things you can do, if your goal is getting votes.
Full disclosure: I'm a punk kid who realizes he may have no idea what he's talking about. I'm not looking to get into a fight. If you disagree with me, just politely inform me why I'm wrong, and I'll listen.
In my ideal world, and maybe this is just me, but if you're going to write about something, you should have some knowledge about it before you start spouting off about this or that. He should have some credentials. The fact that people take him seriously when he doesn't appear to have any credentials about politics is something I disagree with and it worries me. You have people like Muppet and other Bernie Sanders supporters taking what he says seriously without applying any critical reasoning to what he said.
I think climate change is a real thing. I think everyone should try to stop it. The US should pass a Carbon Tax. However, I have absolutely no science background. Who knows how much or how little I actually know about climate change or science at all. People shouldn't put any weight in my opinions. A website should not let me write about climate change.
Greg, to address your point, I don't know anything about your grandfather. I have no idea what he did or how he learned about politics despite not having gone to college. From what little you just wrote, he certainly seems impressive. That being said, if I heard his opinion, because he doesn't have the formal credentials I would normally look for, I would (hopefully) do some background research of my own to see if his opinion was backed up by facts. The more it was, the more I would tend to agree with him and a relationship of trust would be built up over time. In Tony Brasunas's case, he also lacks the formal credentials. Not only that, but what he wrote shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how government works. When you combine those things, it means that his opinion doesn't warrant merit.
http://hypeline.org/controversy-arises-after-trump-2016-painted/
I'm so angry at this type of shit and this is a rather progressive school. It is in the only county of the state that voted for Bernie Sanders over Clinton in the Democratic Primary. What's irritating is too many people assuming that it was probably done by a Trump hater as a set up and that it isn't that disgraceful since everyone paints on that rock.
Edit: Derped on the math, I thought it was more than it was.