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2016 Presidential Election

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  • edited October 2016
    Rym said:

    Naoza said:

    I'm very anti strings and the only way that's happening is if the government is beholden to the people and to the people alone.

    The people didn't want gay marriage. The people were vehemently, majority opposed to desegregation, even long after it was forced by law.

    The people want terrible things.

    Are you advocating against representative democracy?

    Yes, people are horrifying, but unless you have a better idea I'd still rather be governed by something partially made of me, than entirely separate from me.

    I'd love a benevolent dictator but I feel like we've gotten off track somewhere down the line.
    Post edited by Naoza on
  • http://www.cnn.com/2014/05/12/opinion/zelizer-the-case-for-earmarks/ Actually think the banning of Earmarks actually hurt our ability to get bills crafted.
  • I have yet to be convinced that any meaningful reform will come from the office of the President (regardless of whoever is in office). The only real change MUST come from the legislature, which means all you young reformers have to actually get your hands dirty beyond just Presidential elections.
  • Naoza said:

    Rym said:

    Naoza said:

    I'm very anti strings and the only way that's happening is if the government is beholden to the people and to the people alone.

    The people didn't want gay marriage. The people were vehemently, majority opposed to desegregation, even long after it was forced by law.

    The people want terrible things.
    Are you advocating against representative democracy?
    Absolutely.

    I want a fiercely independent judiciary, direct representation through POTUS, and heavily filtered representation through congress. I want to ban referendums.
  • Naoza said:


    Are you advocating against representative democracy?

    Yes, people are horrifying, but unless you have a better idea I'd still rather be governed by something partially made of me, than entirely separate from me.

    I'd love a benevolent dictator but I feel like we've gotten off track somewhere down the line.

    "Equality under the law" is a that representative democracy CANNOT cross. The majority should not have the right to make minorities lives miserable through democratic processes.

    Personally, I think the concept of "States" need to be rethought of. Too many state governments like to run their state like a private fiefdom. I simply do not trust certain States to treat anyone except Straight, Rich, White People with a modicum of respect.
  • Rym said:

    Naoza said:

    Rym said:

    Naoza said:

    I'm very anti strings and the only way that's happening is if the government is beholden to the people and to the people alone.

    The people didn't want gay marriage. The people were vehemently, majority opposed to desegregation, even long after it was forced by law.

    The people want terrible things.
    Are you advocating against representative democracy?
    Absolutely.

    I want a fiercely independent judiciary, direct representation through POTUS, and heavily filtered representation through congress. I want to ban referendums.
    I too dream.

    But when I think about things in the realm of reality I just think about one person switching priorities.
  • Raithnor said:

    Naoza said:


    Are you advocating against representative democracy?

    Yes, people are horrifying, but unless you have a better idea I'd still rather be governed by something partially made of me, than entirely separate from me.

    I'd love a benevolent dictator but I feel like we've gotten off track somewhere down the line.

    "Equality under the law" is a that representative democracy CANNOT cross. The majority should not have the right to make minorities lives miserable through democratic processes.

    Personally, I think the concept of "States" need to be rethought of. Too many state governments like to run their state like a private fiefdom. I simply do not trust certain States to treat anyone except Straight, Rich, White People with a modicum of respect.
    "We hold these truths to be self evident... yadda yadda yadda". Yeah, nobody is advocating for the majority making the lives of the minority miserable. That's kinda a big deal here. Sometimes unpopular ideas win, as Rym pointed out, at one time the abolition of slavery was an unpopular idea.

    States have problems and there's a whole bunch of great ways they could be rethought. Unfortunately inertia is really against the idea of abolishing states or abolishing the electoral college. Basically that would be people giving up power in exchange for no gain to said people.

    It might happen if it was the will of the people, though only if the government is beholden to the people and the people alone. Not doners or corporations, people.
  • is this like the 8th October surprise and it's only Oct 7th, I mean in a normal year, Putin defending you would be a big story.
  • The October Advent Calendar of Surprises continues.
  • That "grab women by the pussy" comment is absolutely unbelievable.

    Trumpettes are so desperate for a couner-narrative that they've started completely fabricating bullshit quotes from clinton, e.g. a fake speech where she calls millenials "a bucket of losers" as if that isn't completely derivative of "basket of deplorables" and gives it away as a fake right away.
  • chaosof99 said:

    That "grab women by the pussy" comment is absolutely unbelievable.

    Trumpettes are so desperate for a couner-narrative that they've started completely fabricating bullshit quotes from clinton, e.g. a fake speech where she calls millenials "a bucket of losers" as if that isn't completely derivative of "basket of deplorables" and gives it away as a fake right away.

    You think that's good, I saw some dude claiming evidence of the Clinton campaign engaging in widespread pay for play, with their evidence being...A screenshot of file explorer, purportedly from the DNC leaks, with a folder clearly labeled "Pay for Play." And regardless of if the image was a joke or not, dude genuinely thought it was evidence of a pay for play conspiracy.
  • Trump. I was expecting some October surprise style documents and tapes late in the election run-up, but this is incredible. How can I still be surprised at this? But I am!
  • Churba said:

    chaosof99 said:

    That "grab women by the pussy" comment is absolutely unbelievable.

    Trumpettes are so desperate for a couner-narrative that they've started completely fabricating bullshit quotes from clinton, e.g. a fake speech where she calls millenials "a bucket of losers" as if that isn't completely derivative of "basket of deplorables" and gives it away as a fake right away.

    You think that's good, I saw some dude claiming evidence of the Clinton campaign engaging in widespread pay for play, with their evidence being...A screenshot of file explorer, purportedly from the DNC leaks, with a folder clearly labeled "Pay for Play." And regardless of if the image was a joke or not, dude genuinely thought it was evidence of a pay for play conspiracy.
    Saw that one too. It would be hilarious how delusional these people get, how they swallow everything that supports their held position hook line and sinker and how they twist in a pretzel to deny or excuse anything that goes against them, if it weren't so sad.
  • I was just saying something similar to my girlfriend when she asked me about it. I've been in situations where I've been disgusted and/or dismayed about what another guy is saying about his exploits or attitude towards women. But even then, I didn't hear things like Trump said. He's literally worse than I've ever heard guys say in private.
  • Will the GOP finally collapse?
    Why did it take so long for the last Republicans to realize what they had made?
  • Trump finally insulted the one voting block they couldn't afford to alienate.
  • edited October 2016
    Who, women? How did he not alienate them with literally everything else he has said about women? Was it because his venom was usually targeted at specific women instead of women in general? Did they not see the connection?
    Post edited by GreatTeacherMacRoss on
  • Yes to all of the above.
  • I dunno, I'm still nervous. Complacency is surely what the majority of Brits felt before brexit.
  • I think this may have damaged his base close enough to the election that Hillary just needs to have no more new scandals for a month. I still suspect he will do okay in the popular, but hopefully I'm wrong. If he gets less than 30-40 percent, maybe the Republican party will double down on not doing Trump things in the future. If he gets greater than 40, they must just find someone smarter who can do the Trump stuff that worked without all the bullshit to dredge up.

    But either way, the 2020 election is going to be very interesting.
  • "This is what men talk about."

    No, we don't. That's what juvenile manchildren talk about.
  • Axel said:

    I think this may have damaged his base close enough to the election that Hillary just needs to have no more new scandals for a month.

    They're still trying real hard though, and trying to make hay out of another release of pretty much entirely innocuous emails. It's not working so well.

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