I sort of learned how to command marines. I commanded a good game just now. We were not doing well early, but recovered. Ended up with full upgrades on everything with two command chairs. Still wasn't able to push for a third. We eventually got two dual exos and pushed for third, but lost the other two and gg.
I actually am pretty proud of one move I pulled. Some ninjas took out the harvester in cavern. I had them build a phase gate since there is power there. Then we beaconed and phased in to take out cave. We weren't able to hold it, though. If we had held cave, we probably would have won.
Here are some problems I had commanding, some are my fault and some are not.
I have V bound to talk. V also happens to be recycle. Before I realized it, I had recycled the arms lab and observatory multiple times. I thought aliens were killing them. Rebound the talk key since you can't re-bind recycle key.
Any time I want to medpack or ammo, there are shortcuts for that which I can use anywhere. To scan I have to find an observatory and click on it. They really need a global hotkey for scan. Is there one I don't know about?
I didn't remember I had the nano-shield thingy until just now as I type this. I didn't use it even once.
Sometimes when people ask for medpack I can press space to teleport to them. Other times, not. It's not always obvious where the person is who is asking for medpack/ammo.
When I am giving people meds and ammo they don't always see it. I try to put it in front of them, but they walk right by like it's not there. I can only drop it directly on them about half the time. There should be a way to put the meds/ammo directly into the marines without precise clicking. I also want to see how much ammo people have when I am handing that out.
Onos is less fragile than exo. If it comes down to exo vs. onos the aliens will have more onoses than marines have exos, and they will go down harder. It's also very difficult to get the exos back if you lose them. Onos eggs are plenty. You can't spawn dual-exos only singles using team res.
I have never played any Natural Selections. Should I get NS2?
Yeah, propably. It's not that expensive compared to many other comparable games, it's certainly enjoyable and well made. It's got some depths to explore, but it's also sufficiently fun that you can just jump in for a 20 minute fuckaround match.
229 has completely fucked the balance of the game. With one-hive onos and insane regen, it's damn near impossible for marines to win against even moderate alien players.
229 has completely fucked the balance of the game. With one-hive onos and insane regen, it's damn near impossible for marines to win against even moderate alien players.
I was even having trouble in the previous build against alien. I had a few games where both teams had max tech and enough RTS to buy whatever. While marines could hold for awhile, they couldn't push against onoses even with exos.
Onos can be gotten very early in the game. Exo is way late in the game. What do you do about onos when it appears so quickly?
Onos can operate on its own. It can go in, bust shit up, run away and heal. It's not so fragile. If you manage to get exo, it is much more fragile than onos, much slower. It also can't go back to heal at an armory or anything. Onos can heal at a hive or crag if there is no gorge. Exo absolutely needs support from other players or MACs.
Not sure what to do about it. Maybe try making the exo's gun much more devastating to the point where the one-arm exo becomes useful.
You don't want players to dictate things that affect game mechanics or balance
No but seriously, you should add boarding.
(Side note - I still try to board other ships in GoI online, and I'm very occasionally successful, but it's not about having a boarding mechanic in the game, it's about freaking out other players.)
Obviously they should not just blindly do what everyone is asking. Instead, you need to get a general sense of what is going on in the game, and what to work on next. NS2 is a little different from a game like CS, because it isn't already perfect. It's still unbalanced and in rapid development.
Consider that a lot of people submitted things like give marines HMG. That's incredibly specific advice you shouldn't follow. However, I think it is pretty clear that there is some amount of frustration with the limited variety in the marine arsenal. You play NS2 and 90% of the time it's all LMG. Meanwhile aliens are messing with all these crazy lifeforms and shit. That's the kind of thing you can take away from this.
Scott has a good point. You do have to consider all the suggestions, but consider doesn't mean implement.
Sure, you COULD implement a HMG for the marines. Or, you could consider why some players are feeling this way, what they're asking for, and excise the problem at the root, rather than just pulling leaves.
Something I have learned as a game designer is the people don't know what they actually want, but people do know when they want, as in, when something is found wanting. When people make suggestions, it's not the specific advice you need to follow; it's the attention pointed towards a certain mechanic showing you that, not even nessesarily that something is wrong, but that something is creating a perception of wrongness. Shaping the perspective of your players is just as important as the actuality of the situation, but then it's up to you, as the game designer, to filter out their fantasy requests and figure out what specifically is causing either the problem, or the perception of the problem. (After all, player perception is a huge part of how a game is recieved. A game can be perfectly balanced but a unit can create frustration through the perception of imbalance to the point where things are no longer fun.)
Good personal example; a few of my playtesters on Hardboiled told me that the rules for shooting into crowds was grossly overpowered as written and it was the biggest balance issue in the game. I ran some numbers and did some tests and nothing seemed out of the ordinary, but then I realized the example I gave and the way I phrased the rule made it look much more dangerous than it was. So I just changed the language around and the playtesters all approved immediately.
I'd really like an in-game clock. I think it would cut down on that weird time-warping effect that happens, where I play for 10 minutes and 4 hours go by.
Speaking of timings, I'm curious what the fastest time is for y'all alien players to get an Onos egg. In my experience, I see them start popping out at about 12 minutes, but I've managed to get one (as in, hatch from one) as early as 11 minutes 6 seconds, which is the fastest I've seen.
Timings like these seem like they'd be pretty useful to know when commanding.
When you have a competent commander and players on both teams, the experience can be phenomenal.
Recently I was in a superb match. At one point in time, we had to get a critical power node back online. The squad proceeded to Nano where the battle against a few skulks ensued. Automatic fire rang out in unison, and within a few seconds man and skulk hit the floor. It was however, not over. I alone was left standing, barely holding my own against this arrogant skulk, flaunting celertiy and lerp with a more than modest amount of pride. I panicked, emptying my rifle in an almost pointless endeavor. I switched to my pistol and managed to land a few good hits, but fall the skulk did not. Barely alive solely because of jumping around like a lunatic, I pulled out my axe. Thinking it was over as the skulk approached me for the kill, I saw a medpack appear on the ground. Like an answer from the gods, my body was imbued with the blue glow of shielding. I felt the power! I charged at that skulk with my axe and had death break down its front door! With immense haste, I completed the power node and got the power back online. As the light slowly but surely came back online, I felt inspired with a feeling of "let there be light." GG at this time? I think not!
Well, that's my silly attempt at "creative writing." In my opinion, that match deserved more than just vanilla english.
Played for the first time in several weeks and I've suddenly become horrible at this. I remember being able to kill things as Skulk and being somewhat capable, as marine, but no. Played a few rounds and I just sucked.
Played for the first time in several weeks and I've suddenly become horrible at this. I remember being able to kill things as Skulk and being somewhat capable, as marine, but no. Played a few rounds and I just sucked.
My biting skill has gone to shit, but I think it might be due to cheaters/pros. I had no trouble biting guys who sucked. Some other people were getting me around corners and shit.
Played for the first time in several weeks and I've suddenly become horrible at this. I remember being able to kill things as Skulk and being somewhat capable, as marine, but no. Played a few rounds and I just sucked.
I played a round of marine and we were up against alien that plays like me. On the walls, slow walking, crazy jumping and mad team ups. There was only one guy on the marines who could keep up. He was the only one doing shit worth a damn. I mean it was fucking embarrassing. I just gg'd at the end and went to play some CS:GO. I always do better as alien especially against exos, it's fun to hide behind them.
NS2 brings up a problem I've always had, and I think I may have screwed myself in the past. I used to play Unreal Tournament 1, the 2004 religiously back in the day. And everytime someone came up to me, I would just dodge - and even better in ut2k4, super dodge - away from enemies cause I preferred the ranged weapons. So over the years, I've basically trained myself to play at range, so I fuckup as marines much of the time. So, basically when playing marine, I really try to support. Maybe I should have started using the flak cannon back in the day. I panic with the LMG too often. Maybe I should reinstall UT2k4 and try some flak cannon only matches. I really need to get a feel of shit close to me.
I'm actually good at commanding now, for both sides. Not great, but good.
When you command you realize that the FPSing is really what makes a win or a loss. A bad commander can guarantee a loss. A good commander can enable the chance of victory. If both comms do the job properly, the win is decided by the players.
You don't know how many games I've played where commanding was so incredibly easy because my players were so good. I built resource towers, and they never went down. My team was always pushing comfortably, and I was always building up right behind them getting upgrades ASAP.
I have also played games where no amount of commanding skill can save the team. Every res tower that goes up, goes down immediately. The team can't get out of base without dying. Nothing the commander can do will help. Best to just get out and kill things or F4.
I recommend everyone learn to command at least decently and do it a few times for each side. You can begin to see how getting just one upgrade pushes the battle lines forward. I got carapace, they start pushing the next hive immediately afterwards. I get shotguns, they take another tower.
The biggest thing as a player you have to realize is just how big a deal it is to take out a res tower, especially early. Whether you are marine or alien, sneak behind the battle lines and axe/bite a harvester/extractor. When axing a harvester, hit one cyst (the one next to the harvester) first. That way the harvester will start killing itself since it has to infestation. This is the best thing you can do for your team, and it now constitutes most of my early and mid game play.
It's nice but really odd to go into a game and hear the voice chat consisting of people coaching the rest of the team through the basics.
My commanding notes: An observatory should be on the first tier of buildings you create as it lets you know if aliums are sneaking into your base. Marines do not work well with static defences, getting shotguns should happen long before sentry guns.
Comments
I actually am pretty proud of one move I pulled. Some ninjas took out the harvester in cavern. I had them build a phase gate since there is power there. Then we beaconed and phased in to take out cave. We weren't able to hold it, though. If we had held cave, we probably would have won.
Here are some problems I had commanding, some are my fault and some are not.
I have V bound to talk. V also happens to be recycle. Before I realized it, I had recycled the arms lab and observatory multiple times. I thought aliens were killing them. Rebound the talk key since you can't re-bind recycle key.
Any time I want to medpack or ammo, there are shortcuts for that which I can use anywhere. To scan I have to find an observatory and click on it. They really need a global hotkey for scan. Is there one I don't know about?
I didn't remember I had the nano-shield thingy until just now as I type this. I didn't use it even once.
Sometimes when people ask for medpack I can press space to teleport to them. Other times, not. It's not always obvious where the person is who is asking for medpack/ammo.
When I am giving people meds and ammo they don't always see it. I try to put it in front of them, but they walk right by like it's not there. I can only drop it directly on them about half the time. There should be a way to put the meds/ammo directly into the marines without precise clicking. I also want to see how much ammo people have when I am handing that out.
Onos is less fragile than exo. If it comes down to exo vs. onos the aliens will have more onoses than marines have exos, and they will go down harder. It's also very difficult to get the exos back if you lose them. Onos eggs are plenty. You can't spawn dual-exos only singles using team res.
Onos can be gotten very early in the game. Exo is way late in the game. What do you do about onos when it appears so quickly?
Onos can operate on its own. It can go in, bust shit up, run away and heal. It's not so fragile. If you manage to get exo, it is much more fragile than onos, much slower. It also can't go back to heal at an armory or anything. Onos can heal at a hive or crag if there is no gorge. Exo absolutely needs support from other players or MACs.
Not sure what to do about it. Maybe try making the exo's gun much more devastating to the point where the one-arm exo becomes useful.
http://t.co/lTVxB28P
It's also important that they ignore all specific suggestions, and find and address the actual underlying problems/desires.
(Side note - I still try to board other ships in GoI online, and I'm very occasionally successful, but it's not about having a boarding mechanic in the game, it's about freaking out other players.)
Consider that a lot of people submitted things like give marines HMG. That's incredibly specific advice you shouldn't follow. However, I think it is pretty clear that there is some amount of frustration with the limited variety in the marine arsenal. You play NS2 and 90% of the time it's all LMG. Meanwhile aliens are messing with all these crazy lifeforms and shit. That's the kind of thing you can take away from this.
Sure, you COULD implement a HMG for the marines. Or, you could consider why some players are feeling this way, what they're asking for, and excise the problem at the root, rather than just pulling leaves.
Good personal example; a few of my playtesters on Hardboiled told me that the rules for shooting into crowds was grossly overpowered as written and it was the biggest balance issue in the game. I ran some numbers and did some tests and nothing seemed out of the ordinary, but then I realized the example I gave and the way I phrased the rule made it look much more dangerous than it was. So I just changed the language around and the playtesters all approved immediately.
Speaking of timings, I'm curious what the fastest time is for y'all alien players to get an Onos egg. In my experience, I see them start popping out at about 12 minutes, but I've managed to get one (as in, hatch from one) as early as 11 minutes 6 seconds, which is the fastest I've seen.
Timings like these seem like they'd be pretty useful to know when commanding.
When you have a competent commander and players on both teams, the experience can be phenomenal.
Recently I was in a superb match. At one point in time, we had to get a critical power node back online. The squad proceeded to Nano where the battle against a few skulks ensued. Automatic fire rang out in unison, and within a few seconds man and skulk hit the floor. It was however, not over. I alone was left standing, barely holding my own against this arrogant skulk, flaunting celertiy and lerp with a more than modest amount of pride. I panicked, emptying my rifle in an almost pointless endeavor. I switched to my pistol and managed to land a few good hits, but fall the skulk did not. Barely alive solely because of jumping around like a lunatic, I pulled out my axe. Thinking it was over as the skulk approached me for the kill, I saw a medpack appear on the ground. Like an answer from the gods, my body was imbued with the blue glow of shielding. I felt the power! I charged at that skulk with my axe and had death break down its front door! With immense haste, I completed the power node and got the power back online. As the light slowly but surely came back online, I felt inspired with a feeling of "let there be light." GG at this time? I think not!
Well, that's my silly attempt at "creative writing." In my opinion, that match deserved more than just vanilla english.
We lost.
NS2 brings up a problem I've always had, and I think I may have screwed myself in the past. I used to play Unreal Tournament 1, the 2004 religiously back in the day. And everytime someone came up to me, I would just dodge - and even better in ut2k4, super dodge - away from enemies cause I preferred the ranged weapons. So over the years, I've basically trained myself to play at range, so I fuckup as marines much of the time. So, basically when playing marine, I really try to support. Maybe I should have started using the flak cannon back in the day. I panic with the LMG too often. Maybe I should reinstall UT2k4 and try some flak cannon only matches. I really need to get a feel of shit close to me.
Realisation that I am most suited for commander.
[Times passes]
Realisation that directing units has been effectively disabled.
When you command you realize that the FPSing is really what makes a win or a loss. A bad commander can guarantee a loss. A good commander can enable the chance of victory. If both comms do the job properly, the win is decided by the players.
You don't know how many games I've played where commanding was so incredibly easy because my players were so good. I built resource towers, and they never went down. My team was always pushing comfortably, and I was always building up right behind them getting upgrades ASAP.
I have also played games where no amount of commanding skill can save the team. Every res tower that goes up, goes down immediately. The team can't get out of base without dying. Nothing the commander can do will help. Best to just get out and kill things or F4.
I recommend everyone learn to command at least decently and do it a few times for each side. You can begin to see how getting just one upgrade pushes the battle lines forward. I got carapace, they start pushing the next hive immediately afterwards. I get shotguns, they take another tower.
The biggest thing as a player you have to realize is just how big a deal it is to take out a res tower, especially early. Whether you are marine or alien, sneak behind the battle lines and axe/bite a harvester/extractor. When axing a harvester, hit one cyst (the one next to the harvester) first. That way the harvester will start killing itself since it has to infestation. This is the best thing you can do for your team, and it now constitutes most of my early and mid game play.
My commanding notes:
An observatory should be on the first tier of buildings you create as it lets you know if aliums are sneaking into your base.
Marines do not work well with static defences, getting shotguns should happen long before sentry guns.