I kinda want to form a serious NS2 team to compete for reals, but that is too much time investment. Still, Unknown Worlds keeps sanctioning/streaming these matches on twitch.tv.
The Alien Commander is a “gardener” - he interacts directly with the environment (not individual players) to create optimal conditions for growth. He should be “misting” areas, building “walls” and occasionally brushing off intruders. He helps establish the dominance of one species over another. The weeds are marines.
He’s not telling his team what to do - he’s giving them information and providing the best conditions he can and letting them choose their location, lifeform and tactics.
Aim for a very different, almost soothing experience (not “disconnected”, but the comm isn’t the bottleneck to team progress) No direct healing, buffs, orders or anything “given” to a player or group of players (too much like marine and aliens move too fast to work well) No direct damage Can still react to enemy and make choices that affect players (research, structure choice/placement) but players on the ground are left to their own devices to handle situations Aim for the most possible asymmetry and depth In addition, the following problems are present in current game:
Problems (in Build 204)
There is no downside to alien aggression (especially in early game) The alien commander doesn't have many options Too much depends on the make-or-break hive #2 Many of you have been asking for the Gorge to build more What set of changes could address all of these? It dawned on me that an alien structure model where all the alien structures naturally grew over time might solve all these problems! Here's the summary of that change, followed by the detailed version.
Solution - Alien structures mature
Most alien structures take longer to build than in 204. Gorges can help all build structures, not with their “e” key but with his heal spray (including Hive) 2 Hives no longer needed to unlock Tier 2 weapons, and 3 for Tier 3 weapons. Now Hives can evolve Augmentation which does the same thing. All built alien structures now “mature” over time. They start off approximately 20% weaker than in Build 204 and over time, they grow to approximately 20% tougher than they are in Build 204. The amount of time it takes, and the starting and ending health/armor varies by structure. When a structure becomes fully mature, it is granted new capabilities. The alien commander can speed the maturation process though a new ability called Nutrient Mist. This replaces Catalyze. Mist can affect more than one target at a time: affects everything in 3 meter radius. There is no more “research” on the alien side: everything is an “evolution”. So if you lose a structure that had evolved an ability, and then rebuild that structure, you need to re-evolve it. Aliens no longer have a free choice of initial upgrade category (Crag/Shift/Shade) - it is now an evolution on the hive. There is a new Cyst ability called Rupture, which is triggered by the Alien commander for pres. It destroys the Cyst and splashes infestation on nearby enemy targets. Flare and Fury have been removed. Drifters only appear at base Hive for free - they appear before you log in. New hives don’t get free Drifters - you must create them if desired. So Aliens expand more slowly by default. They can expand faster with 1 or more Gorges working in concert with the commander. Aliens are vulnerable where they are building. Gorges really must be protected. As a result of upgrades being more costly for the alien team, they no longer cost pres for aliens. What are the (hopeful) results of this?
Alien base feels alive...because it really is. Creates more asymmetry between the sides. In fact, I can’t think of an RTS that has ever done this. Many more choices for alien commander. Constantly thinking about which structures are most important and the timing of their maturity. Marines also have more interesting options in that they can take the current maturity level of structures into account. Hit the near Mature Harvester, or try to pick off the farther newborn one? Aliens can expand across the map and get more lifeforms and eggs, without unlocking new upgrades. Gives a choice for those paths. It also means aliens have to choose whether to choose an upgrade path for their initial Hive or not (they can skip if they want, to gain more territory). Alien comms have much more to do and think about. They don’t have to wait too long to build Hive. They have many more options to them - as they can go for earlier versions of Mature structures without waiting for 2nd Hive. They could even get tier 3 alien abilities with only 2 hives. Should encourage pre-building hive area sometimes, before dropping hive. Or building it up at the same time. Aliens may have extra hives for just eggs and infestation. Although they may have less evolution choices generally as well. Makes early alien game weaker, and late-game stronger. Fully detailed design is here. We just started playtesting tihs but are hoping to release this in Build 205. Feedback is appreciated but please...read through this entirely and reflect a bit before commenting critically.
It's promising that they recognize there is no downside to early alien aggression.
You start the game, and what do marines have to do? They have to build RTs. What do skulks have to do? Nothing, except eat marines and marine structures. The alien commander does all the growing, not even gorges help with that. Every skulk is out their with nothing to do except bite.
Skulks can sneak, ambush, and go fast. Marines have to actually defend their RTs. An undefended RT will get bitten, guaranteed. So aliens usually take the entire map and marines just hold 2-4 RTs depending if you count the base RT.
Thing is, marines only need a few RTs. If they can actually hold them for any amount of time, they can win it. This is why early mines have been so important. They are the only way for marines to have any sort of extra defense against early skulks.
There is a shotgun delay way over 12ms. You have to lead like a mofo. If the skulk doesn't go where you think he's going, you're fucked. It's really only good against the other lifeforms that are slower and easier to hit.
Defense of depth with sentries. Onoses have trouble getting over them, and often don't notice how rapidly they're amassing damage. Let them come in past the sentry (or to an edge sentry so long as at least one other sentry has LoF on it). Wait until he's gotten into his attack groove, then everyone target one particular onos with your LMGs.
If he starts to run, follow him firing. Half of you will die, but so will he. Onos players rarely retreat in time, and even a little bit of following fire will take them down.
For bonus points, have a marine or two run behind him and block. The extra few seconds will cost him his life.
So, question posed to the forum: What do you think is the best way to take down one (or more. I've been attacked by three at once) Onos(es)?
Lots of marines all shooting the onos simultaneously while avoiding being killed by other lifeforms. Then when the onos starts to run, multiple marines chase it down and shoot it before it can heal.
Naw, if you are good at placing mines in non-obviously spotted locations, you can usually get several kills with them. The key is to saturate an area with mines. Skulks are pretty much the only lifeform that mines are useful against.
Mines are essential in the early game so that you can actually leave a resource tower or phase gate unattended for more than a minute. What's annoying is that in old NS you just had to mine the tower. Now you have to mine the tower and the power node.
Just commandeered for the first time in NS2, as an alien commander. I did some rookie mistakes like gave people wrong upgrades but we got ball rolling quite fast. Fast three hives and lots of harvesters. After that I just gave my aliens all the upgrades and spread the cryst wherever it didn't get instantly destroyed.
It was quite an exciting and teaching experience. For example I hadn't realized how much of an early warning system cryst can be. It's easy to prepare defenses when you see exo-suit slowly approaching stopping every two steps to destroy yet another peace of cryst.
Also in the mach before that one I as a Skulk took down Exo in one on one and people were like "Oh man, that was cool"
When you are just hanging out early or mid-game destroying cyst is a good idea. Late game when you are actually going for the hive, IGNORE ALL CYST. That's even true in NS1. When you are rushing the hive, do not shoot any alien structures along the way or every alien will know you are coming.
As for taking out the exo with a skulk, that is so easy. The developers were very smart. The weakness of the original heavy armor in NS1 was that an onos could just swallow it and that it was slow. The exo suit is just too cool, but how to make it balanced and fair? It has infinite ammo, albeith with cooldown. It's also got so much armor even a fade has a hard time with it. Genius answer is that it can't shoot down! Skulks can just chew its legs off unless the exo suit has friends protecting it by welding and killing skulks. Just like the old HA needed support. In TF2 the heavy benefits from support of a medic. In NS/NS2 support of the heavies is MANDATORY. They are as durable in all ways, but fragile in one very important way.
Comments
The Alien Commander is a “gardener” - he interacts directly with the environment (not individual players) to create optimal conditions for growth. He should be “misting” areas, building “walls” and occasionally brushing off intruders. He helps establish the dominance of one species over another. The weeds are marines.
He’s not telling his team what to do - he’s giving them information and providing the best conditions he can and letting them choose their location, lifeform and tactics.
Aim for a very different, almost soothing experience (not “disconnected”, but the comm isn’t the bottleneck to team progress)
No direct healing, buffs, orders or anything “given” to a player or group of players (too much like marine and aliens move too fast to work well)
No direct damage
Can still react to enemy and make choices that affect players (research, structure choice/placement) but players on the ground are left to their own devices to handle situations
Aim for the most possible asymmetry and depth
In addition, the following problems are present in current game:
Problems (in Build 204)
There is no downside to alien aggression (especially in early game)
The alien commander doesn't have many options
Too much depends on the make-or-break hive #2
Many of you have been asking for the Gorge to build more
What set of changes could address all of these? It dawned on me that an alien structure model where all the alien structures naturally grew over time might solve all these problems! Here's the summary of that change, followed by the detailed version.
Solution - Alien structures mature
Most alien structures take longer to build than in 204.
Gorges can help all build structures, not with their “e” key but with his heal spray (including Hive)
2 Hives no longer needed to unlock Tier 2 weapons, and 3 for Tier 3 weapons.
Now Hives can evolve Augmentation which does the same thing.
All built alien structures now “mature” over time. They start off approximately 20% weaker than in Build 204 and over time, they grow to approximately 20% tougher than they are in Build 204. The amount of time it takes, and the starting and ending health/armor varies by structure.
When a structure becomes fully mature, it is granted new capabilities.
The alien commander can speed the maturation process though a new ability called Nutrient Mist. This replaces Catalyze. Mist can affect more than one target at a time: affects everything in 3 meter radius.
There is no more “research” on the alien side: everything is an “evolution”. So if you lose a structure that had evolved an ability, and then rebuild that structure, you need to re-evolve it.
Aliens no longer have a free choice of initial upgrade category (Crag/Shift/Shade) - it is now an evolution on the hive.
There is a new Cyst ability called Rupture, which is triggered by the Alien commander for pres. It destroys the Cyst and splashes infestation on nearby enemy targets.
Flare and Fury have been removed.
Drifters only appear at base Hive for free - they appear before you log in.
New hives don’t get free Drifters - you must create them if desired.
So Aliens expand more slowly by default. They can expand faster with 1 or more Gorges working in concert with the commander. Aliens are vulnerable where they are building. Gorges really must be protected.
As a result of upgrades being more costly for the alien team, they no longer cost pres for aliens.
What are the (hopeful) results of this?
Alien base feels alive...because it really is.
Creates more asymmetry between the sides. In fact, I can’t think of an RTS that has ever done this.
Many more choices for alien commander. Constantly thinking about which structures are most important and the timing of their maturity.
Marines also have more interesting options in that they can take the current maturity level of structures into account. Hit the near Mature Harvester, or try to pick off the farther newborn one?
Aliens can expand across the map and get more lifeforms and eggs, without unlocking new upgrades. Gives a choice for those paths. It also means aliens have to choose whether to choose an upgrade path for their initial Hive or not (they can skip if they want, to gain more territory).
Alien comms have much more to do and think about. They don’t have to wait too long to build Hive. They have many more options to them - as they can go for earlier versions of Mature structures without waiting for 2nd Hive. They could even get tier 3 alien abilities with only 2 hives.
Should encourage pre-building hive area sometimes, before dropping hive. Or building it up at the same time.
Aliens may have extra hives for just eggs and infestation. Although they may have less evolution choices generally as well.
Makes early alien game weaker, and late-game stronger.
Fully detailed design is here. We just started playtesting tihs but are hoping to release this in Build 205. Feedback is appreciated but please...read through this entirely and reflect a bit before commenting critically.
You start the game, and what do marines have to do? They have to build RTs. What do skulks have to do? Nothing, except eat marines and marine structures. The alien commander does all the growing, not even gorges help with that. Every skulk is out their with nothing to do except bite.
Skulks can sneak, ambush, and go fast. Marines have to actually defend their RTs. An undefended RT will get bitten, guaranteed. So aliens usually take the entire map and marines just hold 2-4 RTs depending if you count the base RT.
Thing is, marines only need a few RTs. If they can actually hold them for any amount of time, they can win it. This is why early mines have been so important. They are the only way for marines to have any sort of extra defense against early skulks.
Anyways, from twitter...
"Yesterday we implemented a fix to a very subtle delay in most attacks. Eg, there was a 12 ms delay for the shotgun."
If he starts to run, follow him firing. Half of you will die, but so will he. Onos players rarely retreat in time, and even a little bit of following fire will take them down.
For bonus points, have a marine or two run behind him and block. The extra few seconds will cost him his life.
It was quite an exciting and teaching experience. For example I hadn't realized how much of an early warning system cryst can be. It's easy to prepare defenses when you see exo-suit slowly approaching stopping every two steps to destroy yet another peace of cryst.
Also in the mach before that one I as a Skulk took down Exo in one on one and people were like "Oh man, that was cool"
As for taking out the exo with a skulk, that is so easy. The developers were very smart. The weakness of the original heavy armor in NS1 was that an onos could just swallow it and that it was slow. The exo suit is just too cool, but how to make it balanced and fair? It has infinite ammo, albeith with cooldown. It's also got so much armor even a fade has a hard time with it. Genius answer is that it can't shoot down! Skulks can just chew its legs off unless the exo suit has friends protecting it by welding and killing skulks. Just like the old HA needed support. In TF2 the heavy benefits from support of a medic. In NS/NS2 support of the heavies is MANDATORY. They are as durable in all ways, but fragile in one very important way.