Jack124, unless you actually wrote this, please don't copy-paste text from other peoples' work without giving a reference. That's called plagiarism, you know.
Seriously, you pick a place to plagiarize, and you pick Breitbart.com?
Also, here's the top ten lies of Joe Biden: 10. "With all due respect, that’s a bunch of malarkey....not a single thing he said is accurate." At the outset of the debate, Biden tried to paint Ryan as a liar--when Biden, in fact, was the one lying. Ryan had pointed out: 1) that the White House had distanced itself from the Cairo embassy's apologies on 9/11; 2) that Obama had failed to speak up for Iranian protestors in 2009; 3) that the Obama administration called Syria's dictator a "reformer"; 4) and that the Obama administration is imposing defense cuts and projecting weakness. All of that is true.
Lets start debunking this shit One Claim at a fucking time, we can call this the "Reagan Bullshit fact Check Check". the First Claim 1. That the White house had distanced itself from the Cairo Embassy apologies on 9/11. It's true facing criticism from the right about apologizing for a extremely dumb film, the administration said that there was no excuse for violence Film or not, but I actually think the Embassy did the right thing. I think the right was way off base and Mitt Romney's attack on that statement before we knew what was going on, lead to a lot of the convention the media was having about what was going on during that day. 2. You'll note, that there might have been diplomatic reasons for not speaking out immediately about Iran, could be some hope for negotiations on their nuke program or endless other topics, but I'm sure that's can't be it. If you read around on timelines and such the administration decried the suppression of the protests and violence repeatedly and ahead of most of the rest of world. Read some timelines on the events. The Administration was noting their concern and sympathy early on. Plus nothing makes your cause look great in the middle east then the US backing you. We are totally wanted in these countries and would just be used as an excuse to crack down further on the protesters and call them traitors. 3. I looked into this statement, it's true that Clinton said that some thought Syria's dictator was a reformer and that's because before all this was going on, Assard was signalling he was going to push some reforms, I remember listening to a reporter who interviewed his family talking about how they pulled a fast one on her, she was deeply annoyed that they played her. Assad had promised reforms and well, he ended up breaking them. They had thought he would be less antagonist to Israel but he ended up not pushing those reforms either. He talked a good game and now he's not a "reformer" of that kind anymore. Still It's crazy to call someone out for saying "Some say he's a reformer" when it wasn't completely clear what his deal was. The guy's an asshole.
4. So the Military budget, bigger then the next 20 countries COMBINED. FUCK THAT GUY. We can blow the shit out of any country with a 50% cut.
Factcheckers job should be to present the facts and also the context. Without context factchecking is completely meaningless.
2. "What we did is we saved $716 billion and put it back -- applied it to Medicare." Biden repeated the lie the Obama administration has been telling since before Obamacare passed in 2010: that cuts to Medicare today were savings that extend the life of the program. They would be--if the same $716 billion wasn't also being used to pay for Obamacare. As Ryan pointed out in 2010, and again last night, you can't double-count the same cuts. Taking $716 billion out of Medicare means exactly that--and hurts, not helps, the program's solvency.
Balancing 20 or 30 blatant lies against one or two moderate lies from the Obama campaign (really more creative interpretations) isn't much of an argument.
accurate but misleading. Obama is able to hammer at Romney for this because he does not provide any ways to get to his proposed 20% across the board cut without creating a bigger deficit.
There can be no final word on Romney's tax plan because he hasn't released one, just vague principles. So, damn right Dems should assume the worst, because if it was so great, he'd release details.
I don't know why I bother. Fuck it you guys are right, I'm just a pleb who doesn't know anything.
Your argument seems to boil down to "Yes Romney/Ryan lie, but Obama/Biden do, too!"
And sure, you're right, but nobody's arguing that point. I would argue that the ratio is about 100:1. I don't think Obama is a great president. I'd like to see Elizabeth Warren with Kucinich as VP, maybe, but we're not gonna get that, so I have to be content with voting against Romney/Ryan, who are psychopathic libertarian scumbags.
To be fair I'm a libertarian scumbag and they never show up to the meetings.
And frankly, the way you argue political points on this forum, displaying quite a lot of ignorance and dismissing facts, figures, and established theory, makes me not surprised at all that you're a Libertarian. I figure you're in your lower 20s, so you have time to grow out of it.
I don't know why I bother. Fuck it you guys are right, I'm just a pleb who doesn't know anything.
Your argument seems to boil down to "Yes Romney/Ryan lie, but Obama/Biden do, too!"
And sure, you're right, but nobody's arguing that point. I would argue that the ratio is about 100:1. I don't think Obama is a great president. I'd like to see Elizabeth Warren with Kucinich as VP, maybe, but we're not gonna get that, so I have to be content with voting against Romney/Ryan, who are psychopathic libertarian scumbags.
Don't hope for Warren yet. We haven't seen her in office. We don't know if she will actually do anything, do bad things, or say stuff without doing anything.
I don't know why I bother. Fuck it you guys are right, I'm just a pleb who doesn't know anything.
Your argument seems to boil down to "Yes Romney/Ryan lie, but Obama/Biden do, too!"
And sure, you're right, but nobody's arguing that point. I would argue that the ratio is about 100:1. I don't think Obama is a great president. I'd like to see Elizabeth Warren with Kucinich as VP, maybe, but we're not gonna get that, so I have to be content with voting against Romney/Ryan, who are psychopathic libertarian scumbags.
Don't hope for Warren yet. We haven't seen her in office. We don't know if she will actually do anything, do bad things, or say stuff without doing anything.
NOOOOOOOooooOOOOOoooOOO Jack124, keep arguing, some of your points do make sense just don't copy something from somewhere else without linking to it :-p We need more people to challenge the echo chamber, just don't be surprised when you are rationalized up and down. That's what discussions/debates/arguments are about. Don't give up maybe we'll all be libertarians some day :-p
//I'd rather we had people that didn't agree testing our echo chamber.
That said, I have inlaws who are really into foreign policy, after talking to my wife's aunt, about her time as the assistant National Security Adviser during the 9/11 bush years, I've grown to decide that most decisions on foreign policy and world events, we witness, we barely understand the reason behind it because we only usually see about 1/4 of the information and usually those making the decisions only have 2/4 of the information. It was a real eye opener, which lead me to not jump to conclusions right off the bat with anyone who actually is involved in foreign policy decisions, unlike what we see during campaigns.
Warren/Kusinich would be an interesting ticket, and would be the only scenario in which I'd vote for the latter. I agree with him on a lot of issues (probably more than Obama), but I distrust his anti-science woo.
If Shirley Chisholm was alive today, I'd vote for her.
EDIT: I wish the Pirate Party would run a candidate. It looks like they're endorsing Stein and Johnson, neither of which I like very much.
Comments
Or at least come up with an original thought.
4. So the Military budget, bigger then the next 20 countries COMBINED. FUCK THAT GUY. We can blow the shit out of any country with a 50% cut.
Factcheckers job should be to present the facts and also the context. Without context factchecking is completely meaningless.
http://www.factcheck.org/2012/08/ryans-vp-spin/
HOW MANY TIMES DOES THIS HAVE TO BE DEBUNKED.
accurate but misleading. Obama is able to hammer at Romney for this because he does not provide any ways to get to his proposed 20% across the board cut without creating a bigger deficit.
And sure, you're right, but nobody's arguing that point. I would argue that the ratio is about 100:1. I don't think Obama is a great president. I'd like to see Elizabeth Warren with Kucinich as VP, maybe, but we're not gonna get that, so I have to be content with voting against Romney/Ryan, who are psychopathic libertarian scumbags.
//I'd rather we had people that didn't agree testing our echo chamber.
That said, I have inlaws who are really into foreign policy, after talking to my wife's aunt, about her time as the assistant National Security Adviser during the 9/11 bush years, I've grown to decide that most decisions on foreign policy and world events, we witness, we barely understand the reason behind it because we only usually see about 1/4 of the information and usually those making the decisions only have 2/4 of the information. It was a real eye opener, which lead me to not jump to conclusions right off the bat with anyone who actually is involved in foreign policy decisions, unlike what we see during campaigns.
If Shirley Chisholm was alive today, I'd vote for her.
EDIT: I wish the Pirate Party would run a candidate. It looks like they're endorsing Stein and Johnson, neither of which I like very much.
REPUBLICANS, NOW YOU MUST CHOOSE!