No, sorry, we have very different philosophies here. I think that humans are not ready for certain things at certain ages.
Oh, I agree. I just think there's literally no way to "solve" the problem. There is no way to prevent them from finding that stuff. No way in the world. We need a more pragmatic way to handle it.
There's no tie at all between who a media is intended to be consumed by and who actually consumes it. There is no such thing as "children's" media in the modern world: everything overlaps.
When I was young, I had 100% reign over my Internet (and pre-Internet) access. No filters, no restrictions, and no oversight. The first thing I ever searched for on the Internet? "Bomb making instructions." Number of bombs made and used for any purpose other than blowing up trashcans in the woods? Zero.
Children need to grow up learning that wandering around online is like wandering around outside. Net-savvy parents need to teach their kids to be the same way at a very early age. Filters are useless. Culture is evolving more rapidly than flesh. Adapt or be obsolete. ;^)
My parents had some filters on me, but had a blanket rule of "If it's a book, you can read it. No questions asked." I chose to read Dave Barry Turns 40 at age 7. I think it screwed me up for life.
I'm inclined to agree with Rym here - a strong tie between changelings and ponies looks like the best explanation. In fact, they may even be unable to change into non pony-like forms.
The other interesting thing is, where and how have the changelings have been feeding up until they decided to attack Equestria? Have they been ravaging other countries, or hiding within Equestria and consuming love only in small amounts to remain unnoticed, or something else?
Late to the party again. As far as I'm concerned r/clopclop is the creepy uncle, not much different than grimdark gore. But the people who have the free time and motivation to run a high-volume website dedicated to a single TV show tend to be a little odd. It's hard to ignore the fact that all that stuff shows up in Ponibooru, which is the community's main image site. Only Bronibooru is clean.
Oh, I agree. I just think there's literally no way to "solve" the problem. There is no way to prevent them from finding that stuff. No way in the world. We need a more pragmatic way to handle it.
As a front line, GIS with easily changed content settings guarantees there's no way to prevent it. Back in my day we had to work to find that stuff on Usenet and such. Unfortunately the only solution I see is to lock down every household computer with crapware, or try to be constantly present while they're using it. Neither is really acceptable.
Are there tablet apps that give lots of parental control over what can be used? That would be a start. It seems to be what most of the younger kids are using.
Any smart kid can get unfiltered Internet no matter what their parents do (short of locking them in a Faraday cage until they turn 18). Any dumb kid will get unfiltered Internet access by means of some smart kid they know. There is no way around this.
Any smart kid can get unfiltered Internet no matter what their parents do (short of locking them in a Faraday cage until they turn 18). Any dumb kid will get unfiltered Internet access by means of some smart kid they know. There is no way around this.
Yeah, if and when I become a parent, I'm not going to filter the internet on my kids. I'll attempt to teach them responsible usage and maybe put blocks on them installing random crapware best I can until I know they're smart enough not to do so (or only allow them to use Linux :P ). Combine that with not letting them use the internet on their own without checking in on them periodically, and I'm hoping that will keep things okay. I also won't try to limit them from searching for the same kind of crap I did when I was young (within reason -- I still want to keep them from visiting shady sites after all). In my case, though, it was looking for hacking and bomb making instructions on dial-up BBSes as consumer internet wasn't available yet when I was a kid.
I don't filter my daughter's internet and never have. What I do is keep her computer in the living room with the screen facing the room, talk to her about responsible usage and online safety, teach her values and morals, and let her at it.
That doesn't mean I'm comfortable with the way it all works.
Any smart kid can get unfiltered Internet no matter what their parents do (short of locking them in a Faraday cage until they turn 18). Any dumb kid will get unfiltered Internet access by means of some smart kid they know. There is no way around this.
By age ~11, yeah. I would bet you can lock them down while they're still in elementary school, certainly until they're 8 or 9. Of course I didn't really get internet until AOL put up dialup in my area around age 12, and I don't have kids, so maybe I'm uniformed.
I don't filter my daughter's internet and never have. What I do is keep her computer in the living room with the screen facing the room, talk to her about responsible usage and online safety, teach her values and morals, and let her at it.
That doesn't mean I'm comfortable with the way it all works.
You don't have to be comfortable with it, you just have to accept it. The world works the way the world works. The Internet works the way the Internet works.
Trying to change the Internet is like trying to fight the laws of thermodynamics. I really don't like those laws. If I could, I would change them, but I can't. Trying to change them is futile, and I accept that. Instead, I learn to cope in a world where those laws exist.
Instead of trying to get rid of spacedicks, because you can't, learn to survive in a world where spacedicks exist.
I don't filter my daughter's internet and never have. What I do is keep her computer in the living room with the screen facing the room, talk to her about responsible usage and online safety, teach her values and morals, and let her at it.
That's the best way to do it.
That doesn't mean I'm comfortable with the way it all works.
Yeap. But there's literally no way around that.
Conservatism in a generalized sense seems to stem from the fact that culture and technology are constantly changing. The more this nearly universal discomfort with said changes affects a person, the more conservative they are. As the momentum of change is ever greater, they are ever-more-uncomfortable as they get older.
But some people, for whatever reason, are entirely unaffected by this discomfort. I happen to be one of those people. My frame of reference advances one day per day. When kids are getting wings or tails implanted for fashion, I won't view it any differently than ear piercings or tattoos.
In fact, the more things change, and the faster they change, the more excited I become. If anything, I want things to change faster. Babies with brains wired into the Internet before they're even delivered. Downloading other people's memories. GitS-style cybersex. Genetic manipulation furries walking around at conventions. Bio-engineered Pokemon that are real pets. Bring it all on, as fast as possible.
I don't filter my daughter's internet and never have. What I do is keep her computer in the living room with the screen facing the room, talk to her about responsible usage and online safety, teach her values and morals, and let her at it.
That's the best way to do it.
That doesn't mean I'm comfortable with the way it all works.
Yeap. But there's literally no way around that.
Conservatism in a generalized sense seems to stem from the fact that culture and technology are constantly changing. The more this nearly universal discomfort with said changes affects a person, the more conservative they are. As the momentum of change is ever greater, they are ever-more-uncomfortable as they get older.
But some people, for whatever reason, are entirely unaffected by this discomfort. I happen to be one of those people. My frame of reference advances one day per day. When kids are getting wings or tails implanted for fashion, I won't view it any differently than ear piercings or tattoos.
In fact, the more things change, and the faster they change, the more excited I become. If anything, I want things to change faster. Babies with brains wired into the Internet before they're even delivered. Downloading other people's memories. GitS-style cybersex. Genetic manipulation furries walking around at conventions. Bio-engineered Pokemon that are real pets. Bring it all on, as fast as possible.
Yes, bring it all as fast as possible. Then I will be second in line behind Rym to get signed up. That way when they fuck his neural implant, they'll get mine right.
I don't filter my daughter's internet and never have. What I do is keep her computer in the living room with the screen facing the room, talk to her about responsible usage and online safety, teach her values and morals, and let her at it.
Keeping you kid's computer outside of their room is a good idea. It stopped working for me when I was twelve and my parents were okay with me being home alone after school. But really, at around 12-14 you can't really traumatize a kid with bad things.
Moreover, I don't see anything wrong with kids learning on their own that the world is full of terrible people who do scary/absurd things, as long as they're not actively in danger. Teach your kid to avoid obvious traps and viruses on the internet , and they'll likely be fine. It's the kids who get actively and strongly sheltered form these things who turn out such that they're not really able to deal with the world.
I AM considering blocking everything to do with "Vocaloids" at the router, though. :-P
How would you filter for "Vocaloids" at the router?
Also, what do you have against animations of guys and girls in outfits reminiscent of Japanese school uniforms singing songs with computer-generated voices?
I AM considering blocking everything to do with "Vocaloids" at the router, though. :-P
How would you filter for "Vocaloids" at the router?
Also, what do you have against animations of guys and girls in outfits reminiscent of Japanese school uniforms singing songs with computer-generated voices?
Moreover, I don't see anything wrong with kids learning on their own that the world is full of terrible people who do scary/absurd things, as long as they're not actively in danger. Teach your kid to avoid obvious traps and viruses on the internet , and they'll likely be fine. It's the kids who get actively and strongly sheltered form these things who turn out such that they're not really able to deal with the world.
There's being too sheltered and then there's jaded and traumatized on the other end. No 12-14 year old needs to handle /r/spacedicks and its ilk.
There's being too sheltered and then there's jaded and traumatized on the other end. No 12-14 year old needs to handle /r/spacedicks and its ilk.
Nobody needs to handle /r/spacedicks, but if they're aware that the internet is a terrible place they'll probably be able to. I think I got goatse'd for the first time when I was 13. I closed the browser window immediately, thought "well, now I've seen goatse" and went about my business.
I first heard about 2Girls1Cup when I was something like 11, but I wasn't an idiot so I didn't go watch it. first went on /b/ when I was 14, and didn't like it so I didn't return.
I think the quote "Then there's Rarity... Total knock-out. Twilight doesn't think I have a chance but, pffft, what does she know?" is a better quote for spike. And Twlight's quote is a broken aesop.
You know, I found out real world things that disturbed me to my very core in elementary school as part of the general curriculum. I remember specifically the day in fifth or sixth grade when I realized the extent of what had been done during the holocaust. I knew vaguely about Nazis and that they were bad people who started wars and killed Jews well before that point, but I had never seen pictures. I didn't know about the experiments. I had never seen with my eyes images of the piles of emaciated, naked bodies being torched with fire, or the trains.
As a young child I found out about Hiroshima, and could not grock it at first. I found out about medieval torture, and spent a long time laying on the floor, wondering how people could be so wretched. I mean, even just a few years ago, I found out medieval Europeans used to burn cats in baskets for FUN. This deeply disturbed me and I felt worse for having known it, but it was the truth of what occurred and I could not unlearn it. You can avoid the details of specific serial killers and rapists, but you cannot hide from the truth that they exist out there, that there are human specimens full of such evil that merely knowing of their presence is a terrible weight upon the mind.
All this is knowledge. One must deal with the knowledge of the truth of humanity, both good and bad as they get older. Innocence is just another romanticized form of ignorance, and to be strong you need to be able to process the truth as you come across it. It isn't always easy. You need to talk about it and work through it, but in the end you become able to understand the world that much better.
And here you are worried that a 13 year old might be irrevocably scarred by lesbian pony fanfiction and a couple of anime twins pretending to flirt. Whatever.
I do think that children can be traumatized by witnessing violence, and that we should try to provide a healthy environment for their psychological development. However, the internet is just like the real world, full of grim knowledge we cannot completely guard against. The best we can do is let them know what virtual alleys it is best not to loiter in, and support them as they grow up and learn knowledge both good and bad.
"As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1."
I suppose I was comparing the knowledge of Nazis to other scarring knowledge you could encounter, but I'm not going to refrain from discussing an emotional turning point in my young life because it might trigger a Godwin. Nazis are used in arguments for a reason: They are usually one of the worst possible examples of human behavior that people can think of, representing so much of what is bad about the world. When I understood Nazis I got REALLY UPSET. I thought I was going to throw up and cry.
Also, if that's the main thing you got out of that post Greg, seriously...I don't even...
I've always heard it as probability of Nazis or Hitler being discussed, not comparison. Also, I did get more out of that post, just not more to add. You were spot on.
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The other interesting thing is, where and how have the changelings have been feeding up until they decided to attack Equestria? Have they been ravaging other countries, or hiding within Equestria and consuming love only in small amounts to remain unnoticed, or something else?
Are there tablet apps that give lots of parental control over what can be used? That would be a start. It seems to be what most of the younger kids are using.
That doesn't mean I'm comfortable with the way it all works.
Trying to change the Internet is like trying to fight the laws of thermodynamics. I really don't like those laws. If I could, I would change them, but I can't. Trying to change them is futile, and I accept that. Instead, I learn to cope in a world where those laws exist.
Instead of trying to get rid of spacedicks, because you can't, learn to survive in a world where spacedicks exist.
Conservatism in a generalized sense seems to stem from the fact that culture and technology are constantly changing. The more this nearly universal discomfort with said changes affects a person, the more conservative they are. As the momentum of change is ever greater, they are ever-more-uncomfortable as they get older.
But some people, for whatever reason, are entirely unaffected by this discomfort. I happen to be one of those people. My frame of reference advances one day per day. When kids are getting wings or tails implanted for fashion, I won't view it any differently than ear piercings or tattoos.
In fact, the more things change, and the faster they change, the more excited I become. If anything, I want things to change faster. Babies with brains wired into the Internet before they're even delivered. Downloading other people's memories. GitS-style cybersex. Genetic manipulation furries walking around at conventions. Bio-engineered Pokemon that are real pets. Bring it all on, as fast as possible.
Moreover, I don't see anything wrong with kids learning on their own that the world is full of terrible people who do scary/absurd things, as long as they're not actively in danger. Teach your kid to avoid obvious traps and viruses on the internet , and they'll likely be fine. It's the kids who get actively and strongly sheltered form these things who turn out such that they're not really able to deal with the world.
Also, what do you have against animations of guys and girls in outfits reminiscent of Japanese school uniforms singing songs with computer-generated voices?
I remember specifically the day in fifth or sixth grade when I realized the extent of what had been done during the holocaust. I knew vaguely about Nazis and that they were bad people who started wars and killed Jews well before that point, but I had never seen pictures. I didn't know about the experiments. I had never seen with my eyes images of the piles of emaciated, naked bodies being torched with fire, or the trains.
As a young child I found out about Hiroshima, and could not grock it at first. I found out about medieval torture, and spent a long time laying on the floor, wondering how people could be so wretched. I mean, even just a few years ago, I found out medieval Europeans used to burn cats in baskets for FUN. This deeply disturbed me and I felt worse for having known it, but it was the truth of what occurred and I could not unlearn it. You can avoid the details of specific serial killers and rapists, but you cannot hide from the truth that they exist out there, that there are human specimens full of such evil that merely knowing of their presence is a terrible weight upon the mind.
All this is knowledge. One must deal with the knowledge of the truth of humanity, both good and bad as they get older. Innocence is just another romanticized form of ignorance, and to be strong you need to be able to process the truth as you come across it. It isn't always easy. You need to talk about it and work through it, but in the end you become able to understand the world that much better.
And here you are worried that a 13 year old might be irrevocably scarred by lesbian pony fanfiction and a couple of anime twins pretending to flirt. Whatever.
I do think that children can be traumatized by witnessing violence, and that we should try to provide a healthy environment for their psychological development. However, the internet is just like the real world, full of grim knowledge we cannot completely guard against. The best we can do is let them know what virtual alleys it is best not to loiter in, and support them as they grow up and learn knowledge both good and bad.
I suppose I was comparing the knowledge of Nazis to other scarring knowledge you could encounter, but I'm not going to refrain from discussing an emotional turning point in my young life because it might trigger a Godwin. Nazis are used in arguments for a reason: They are usually one of the worst possible examples of human behavior that people can think of, representing so much of what is bad about the world. When I understood Nazis I got REALLY UPSET. I thought I was going to throw up and cry.
Also, if that's the main thing you got out of that post Greg, seriously...I don't even...