I can definitely relate to being a try-hard. Its a product of years and years of rejection.
Well at least you can admit it.
When I decided I needed to go out and meet more gamers, it was because I didn't want to be "that guy" and push all of my friends into playing heavier games they weren't up for, or always wanting to play board games when we got together. I was probably over-eager a bit then too, but everything Scott said is 100% correct. Relax. Chill out, and just have a good time.
It's not a point of shame for me, why not admit it? I had a childhood that predisposed me to be socially awkward, and that's an understatement. I do my best, but sometimes it's very very frustrating when your best is weird to most people and becoming a try-hard at least some of the time is sort of inevitable.
CAH is fun mainly for a large group setting with people to only play every now and then. It's a game that shouldn't be played frequently.
The reason there was so much of it at PAX is because it's an easy break out game that anyone can pretty much play and enjoy.
My only difficulty right now is the distance of where I have to go to play Netrunner games with different people.
As for another problem with gaming is when your group gets too large and when you break out a game, some people will be left out. The problem is that sometimes people want to play X game with Y person(s). The simple solution to this is to be an easy going person and just go with the flow. If are part of a group that has a lot of people but a certain board game can't fit all of you, find another game to play with the extra people or bust out your DS or smart phone.
More can be said about this situation, and I can guarantee you will see this at PAX.
Sadly, we propose no solutions. The greater problem is simple.
If every single person here is 0% "that guy," the one true "that guy" out there in the wild, covered in cheetos and stink, spends every waking hour responding to every public discussion on forming a gaming group.
There is no way to openly and publicly seek other gamers for your group without him finding you. Your only hope is to solicit from behind a wall. Everyone does this (hell, even the FRC has a private forum).
The very worst of all stereotypes is out there. His SONAR is pinging full on. He has poisoned the well for everyone else. Gamers are blind among the blind, more fearful of him than of finding no one.
Oh, well we have a Cheetos-covered smelly guy in my group. He fixed his problem by spending every dollar of disposable income he had on a sweet LAN gaming rig including private servers that push game installs, gigabit ethernet, a ridiculously large and well built gaming table for role playing and miniatures, and so on. His basement is basically one of those LAN gaming establishments that briefly existed in the early naughts, on steroids.
So, by becoming the best available host, he's now in the group, and actually, the LESS awkward you are, the less you fit in there.
"That Guy" takes energy to deal with. Sometimes we just don't have that energy. I have to be in the right kind of mood to help someone deal with social issues. I'm willing to do it, to a certain extent, but fuck, it is hard work. Not the kind of thing I want to do at cons (and a weekend isn't enough time anyway).
I'm "that guy" about cards against humanity. I kinda hate that game. I can play it, but it has never resonated with me very much. Further, seeing every person ever playing it at PAX and hearing the same jokes every five steps really kills the novelty. That said, I won $5 off Rym at PAX, so there's that.
I've been through the deck 2x, and now I'm done with it. It's a limited replayability game. I would play with the expansion decks as long as they were the majority of the cards and not just added into the standard deck.
Friends and I are also tiring on CAH, and need to recharge the batteries. New cards will come though. I will still play it if it's a fresh group though, just to get the pleasure of introducing it to them.
CAH is a "bait game." At a party, I'll use it to distract the people who won't play other, better games and get them to disappear into another room for three hours. ;^)
CAH is a "bait game." At a party, I'll use it to distract the people who won't play other, better games and get them to disappear into another room for three hours. ;^)
I have done exactly this. That said, it often also distracts one or two people I could use on another game.
You can tell a lot about people based on how they play CAH. Going off of this thread's topic, we actually decided not to invite a couple back to our house for future gaming based on what we observed.
My group problem is that all the members of my local group have moved away. Everyone is a minimum of an hour drive in different directions. I have considered forming a new group but I need a way to get new players without getting a group full of people I don't want in my house.
My group problem is that all the members of my local group have moved away. Everyone is a minimum of an hour drive in different directions. I have considered forming a new group but I need a way to get new players without getting a group full of people I don't want in my house.
Is there a game store nearby that you could run a game at until you get to know them better?
You can tell a lot about people based on how they play CAH. Going off of this thread's topic, we actually decided not to invite a couple back to our house for future gaming based on what we observed.
It is one of those games that can be quite a bit revealing if you want to dig into the meta of it.
I think CAH is also better when you play it with less homogenous groups. Getting some different variable humor dynamics is awesome.
I've listened to the episode and I agree it's straight up adverse selection. This is why I don't do naturist events, or look for them, even though I've enjoyed specific ones in the past.
I have met three kinds of RPG players in my search and experience with organising the meetup group. One kind thinks that D&D (or GURPs, Traveller or whatever) is the only RPG. The second kind thinks that really RPG rules are a necessary evil that should be ideally avoided and the best sessions are the ones that are just character talk. I'm of course the kind that believes that the rules shape the game and should be embraced to make the kind of game the players want to play. I know and play with a couple of these type 3s and we have good fun. But I'm worried that I'll become frustrated and maybe even lose the group when a type 2 dude takes over for the next campaign we do. (I wanted to run something but when put on the spot this other guy had this whole setting to talk about and I didn't have shit beyond a few system names.)
I'm seriously intolerant of getting stuck in a game with the wrong kind. I have left sessions in the middle on a couple of occasions like Rym's guy saying "I can't do this game".
I also worry about using people as game components. I do that! I attend a board game club on certain weeks. I need to stay closer to the older guys who like their german style games. The younger ones contain several of Those Guys for me (which seems to be why there are no girls at this club). Those guys have ruined cooperative games like Zombiecide and Super Dungeon Explore just by telling me what to do each turn and why my own ideas of what I should be doing suck.
But back to the RPG players... I use the guys I identify and agree with philosophically for gaming and the most time I spend socially is with the one guy I don't! I've got to treat everyone just bit more like people and not conveniences.
I'm glad that I'm not the only person who recognizes the "that guy" issue. I didn't really know what you guys meant by that term until I started listening to the episode and I was like "holy fuck, this is like 100% accurate to my experiences". That's why I'm hesitant to publicly find any other people to play games with. I did finally find a gaming group that I enjoy a few months ago but they play on Friday nights and I'm usually too tired to go meet up with them.
Until recently I lived in Miami, the only game store just got rid of comics and has about 5 no CCG's; and there are about 1 million people in greater Miami. Now that I am in Orlando; there are 9 great comics stores and 6 amazing game stores; I don't get it; there are far less people in Orlando when compared to Miami. Why is Orlando so much cooler?
Until recently I lived in Miami, the only game store just got rid of comics and has about 5 no CCG's; and there are about 1 million people in greater Miami. Now that I am in Orlando; there are 9 great comics stores and 6 amazing game stores; I don't get it; there are far less people in Orlando when compared to Miami. Why is Orlando so much cooler?
Until recently I lived in Miami, the only game store just got rid of comics and has about 5 no CCG's; and there are about 1 million people in greater Miami. Now that I am in Orlando; there are 9 great comics stores and 6 amazing game stores; I don't get it; there are far less people in Orlando when compared to Miami. Why is Orlando so much cooler?
Orlando has Dice Tower Con?
I wan't able to go last year; I am going this year. But I still don't understand why Orlando has so much culture compared to the shallow puddle that is Miami.
This is a good discussion, and the idea that "that guy" is relative is perfect. Many of the people who are "that guy" to me aren't even close to Cheeto-stink dudes/dudettes who try to hard, by most accounts they're lovely people who I just would not want to play involved games with on a regular basis, or marathon anime with, or work on creative projects with because they don't really meld with what's going to make any of those things an enjoyable experience for me.
This extends beyond a geek setting too. If you put out an open invitation on Facebook seeing if anyone will hang out with you, unless you make use of the feature limiting who will see it, you have to assume the least desirable person is going to hit you up. In business you may network with someone with whom you could have a mutually beneficial working relationship with at a distance, but you keep them at that distance because you know that if you were to work any more closely it could be disastrous.
If only there were some universally understood social mechanism for telling people they're "that guy" to you without hurting their feelings. After all, if "that guy" is relative, "that guy" to you probably isn't "that guy" to everyone and they could probably stand to find other people that they're more compatible with.
[Edit] Though, I guess there must be some level of "that guy" where that isn't true, otherwise they wouldn't be having so much trouble finding people to play board games with.
The problem I find a lot with local groups is that they play at there house; most of the time the host won't allow unknown to come, or new members don't want to go to the house of someone they don't know.
You will always have that guy come when you try to go to a public location. The main question a group needs to ask itself is if it wants to grow in size or to close itself off from the world.
I go to a group that is big enough, that with a bit of foresight, it is possible to avoid that guy. In this case, you can hear him from a mile away explaining the rules, that in itself isn't so bad, however it was when he goes on to explain the best strategy to use in every game before the game that has even started yet that is the problem. Let people discover how to win, otherwise you meant as well just play the game by yourself. At least he doesn't smell though.
One interesting random aside is how different people want rules explained in different ways. A friend of mine explains every single detail and then tries to explain strategy for something like seven wonders. It grates on me, even the first time I was learning the game from him. On the other hand, another friend really hates being given less than the full rulebook which she then proceeds to misinterpret in some way. And yet another guy is the rules-lawyeriest of them all and will argue any possible interpretation that's too his advantage in any game... even when thoroughly refuted by FAQs and the words of the author on BGG so I don't play games with "that guy".
Personally, I think a little differently than a lot of people so some rules explanations fail me as well. I botched Bohnanza the first time I tried to play it with some FRC forum people. I also failed whatever that game we played at the pre pax board game night with the dice assignment mechanic. That said, I had no problem with Ro explaining expansions to seven wonders or Scott explaining Kingdom Builder for the first time for everyone.
For explaing rules I like giving a 5-15 minute intro; the rest I explain as we play or when the player violate them. I find that if I bore people they walk away faster.
Comments
The reason there was so much of it at PAX is because it's an easy break out game that anyone can pretty much play and enjoy.
My only difficulty right now is the distance of where I have to go to play Netrunner games with different people.
As for another problem with gaming is when your group gets too large and when you break out a game, some people will be left out. The problem is that sometimes people want to play X game with Y person(s). The simple solution to this is to be an easy going person and just go with the flow. If are part of a group that has a lot of people but a certain board game can't fit all of you, find another game to play with the extra people or bust out your DS or smart phone.
More can be said about this situation, and I can guarantee you will see this at PAX.
If every single person here is 0% "that guy," the one true "that guy" out there in the wild, covered in cheetos and stink, spends every waking hour responding to every public discussion on forming a gaming group.
There is no way to openly and publicly seek other gamers for your group without him finding you. Your only hope is to solicit from behind a wall. Everyone does this (hell, even the FRC has a private forum).
The very worst of all stereotypes is out there. His SONAR is pinging full on. He has poisoned the well for everyone else. Gamers are blind among the blind, more fearful of him than of finding no one.
So, by becoming the best available host, he's now in the group, and actually, the LESS awkward you are, the less you fit in there.
I think CAH is also better when you play it with less homogenous groups. Getting some different variable humor dynamics is awesome.
I have met three kinds of RPG players in my search and experience with organising the meetup group. One kind thinks that D&D (or GURPs, Traveller or whatever) is the only RPG. The second kind thinks that really RPG rules are a necessary evil that should be ideally avoided and the best sessions are the ones that are just character talk. I'm of course the kind that believes that the rules shape the game and should be embraced to make the kind of game the players want to play. I know and play with a couple of these type 3s and we have good fun. But I'm worried that I'll become frustrated and maybe even lose the group when a type 2 dude takes over for the next campaign we do. (I wanted to run something but when put on the spot this other guy had this whole setting to talk about and I didn't have shit beyond a few system names.)
I'm seriously intolerant of getting stuck in a game with the wrong kind. I have left sessions in the middle on a couple of occasions like Rym's guy saying "I can't do this game".
I also worry about using people as game components. I do that! I attend a board game club on certain weeks. I need to stay closer to the older guys who like their german style games. The younger ones contain several of Those Guys for me (which seems to be why there are no girls at this club). Those guys have ruined cooperative games like Zombiecide and Super Dungeon Explore just by telling me what to do each turn and why my own ideas of what I should be doing suck.
But back to the RPG players... I use the guys I identify and agree with philosophically for gaming and the most time I spend socially is with the one guy I don't! I've got to treat everyone just bit more like people and not conveniences.
Now that I am in Orlando; there are 9 great comics stores and 6 amazing game stores; I don't get it; there are far less people in Orlando when compared to Miami. Why is Orlando so much cooler?
This extends beyond a geek setting too. If you put out an open invitation on Facebook seeing if anyone will hang out with you, unless you make use of the feature limiting who will see it, you have to assume the least desirable person is going to hit you up. In business you may network with someone with whom you could have a mutually beneficial working relationship with at a distance, but you keep them at that distance because you know that if you were to work any more closely it could be disastrous.
If only there were some universally understood social mechanism for telling people they're "that guy" to you without hurting their feelings. After all, if "that guy" is relative, "that guy" to you probably isn't "that guy" to everyone and they could probably stand to find other people that they're more compatible with.
[Edit] Though, I guess there must be some level of "that guy" where that isn't true, otherwise they wouldn't be having so much trouble finding people to play board games with.
You will always have that guy come when you try to go to a public location. The main question a group needs to ask itself is if it wants to grow in size or to close itself off from the world.
In this case, you can hear him from a mile away explaining the rules, that in itself isn't so bad, however it was when he goes on to explain the best strategy to use in every game before the game that has even started yet that is the problem. Let people discover how to win, otherwise you meant as well just play the game by yourself. At least he doesn't smell though.
Personally, I think a little differently than a lot of people so some rules explanations fail me as well. I botched Bohnanza the first time I tried to play it with some FRC forum people. I also failed whatever that game we played at the pre pax board game night with the dice assignment mechanic. That said, I had no problem with Ro explaining expansions to seven wonders or Scott explaining Kingdom Builder for the first time for everyone.