I'm going to give some kind of cold, but very useful, advice.
So we did; our relationship went undefined
Without knowing anything else, this is a bad sign. It's one thing if both parties agree to take a relationship slowly; this still requires the defining of the relationship in some capacity. Whenever you talk about "taking things slowly," you need to figure out what you mean when you say "things."
If the relationship stays in that nebulous undefined area, one or both of you are clearly too insecure to actually move it somewhere. That, or one or both of you are getting played.
Basically, if someone isn't comfortable directly addressing 1)what the relationship is right now and 2)if it has potential to go somewhere, then you should stay the fuck away from that person. Non-committal wishy-washy answers are often an indication of a non-committal wishy-washy person.
I'm sorry that shit sucks. It does. I've been there too. Just pick yourself up and keep trying.
I think that advice is jumping the gun a little though, there's plenty to be said for just dating/non-exclusive relationships. The legitimacy of a relationship or its potential isn't only dictated by how serious it is.
there's plenty to be said for just dating/non-exclusive relationships
Sure, but you need to be able to actually define it as a relationship, y'know? If you have the "what are we" conversation and can't come out of it with an answer, any answer, stay away.
The "what potential does it have" question is more about honest communication of what you're after: "I'm not looking for a serious relationship." "I want a fling." "I am looking for something more than just a fling, but you don't have to think about that right now. Let's revisit the topic in X time." Those are perfectly fine answers. The point is that they're actual answers.
And I don't want to dogpile on Gunter here. As I said, dude, I'm sorry. This is advice I'm giving out of my own experience, the stuff I've learned from going through a lot of the same stuff you're going through. What I can say is that you will probably fall flat a few more times before you figure it out. It sucks, but it's how it works for most people. Chin up, kiddo.
The "what are we" talk really only comes into play once you've been dating for awhile though, that's not a second date proclamation.
Also, people never announce out loud their honest, specific intentions with each other. Sure it would be nice if everyone was a truth telling android but that's just now how it works.
We did have that talk. I forced it because the nebulous relationship that we had going for several months was driving me crazy. With that conversation we had come to the understanding that we were together in some way, and that I could at least trust her not to date other guys. By 'undefined' I meant that we didn't give it a name.
I think the the way this situation ended up comes down to a confluence of extreme emotional pressures on her part, not all of which came to light until a couple of nights ago. I may have been in denial for the last week of it, but it is how it is. Contrary to Code's advice, that stomach-flipping, lightheaded biochemical puppy love had faded. More than anything else I was caught up in her struggle as a person, and how she helped me through mine on a daily basis.
Kaptain K, while he can go eat a bag a leprous dicks, is right on one point. She was an emotionally confused and unstable person, and it was silly of me to get so involved in that. I'll be god damned if it didn't seem worth it until the other night, but what's worth it at the time clearly isn't always what's worth it in the end.
Also, I like how you guys seem to think that I've learned absolutely nothing from this experience. I'm smarter than I look, but the advice is appreciated all the same.
Also, people never announce out loud their honest, specific intentions with each other.
They most certainly can, and do, and should. It's certainly not done often enough, but being straightforward with your intentions avoids pretty much any relationship problem.
Also, I like how you guys seem to think that I've learned absolutely nothing from this experience.
I don't think everyone is actually saying that. I certainly am not. In fact, I'd like to think that all I've done is reinforce the things you already figured out. If anything I said is truly novel to you, then you've got a hell of a lot farther to go than I thought.
They most certainly can, and do, and should. It's certainly not done often enough, but being straightforward with your intentions avoids pretty much any relationship problem.
I don't think everyone is actually saying that. I certainly am not. In fact, I'd like to think that all I've done is reinforce the things you already figured out. If anything I said is truly novel to you, then you've got a hell of a lot farther to go than I thought.
Word up. I know you got your business down, Gunt, but by saying it, then you're not the only person who can learn from it.
They most certainly can, and do, and should. It's certainly not done often enough, but being straightforward with your intentions avoids pretty much any relationship problem.
You're right that people should but it's just not done and if you try to demand that kind of on-the-table honesty out of someone you're likely to just creep them out as nerds are wont to do.
Gays don't have this problem though since we talk turkey right after "Hi". Although what follows usually isn't more than "what, where and when".
Gays don't have this problem though since we talk turkey right after "Hi". Although what follows usually isn't more than "what, where and when".
Well, sure, if you're all looking for casual sex. I know a lot of gay people. Not all of them are after casual sex, and the situations they have are just as complex as heterosexual dating.
Were I gay and looking for casual sex, though, I know a couple of places that I would hit up. I do admit, you people know how to party.
They most certainly can, and do, and should. It's certainly not done often enough, but being straightforward with your intentions avoids pretty much any relationship problem.
You're right that people should but it's just not done and if you try to demand that kind of on-the-table honesty out of someone you're likely to just creep them out as nerds are wont to do.
Gays don't have this problem though since we talk turkey right after "Hi". Although what follows usually isn't more than "what, where and when".
Your sweeping generalizations are getting annoying, Kaptain K.
Most of the gay men I know are totally unlike what you just stated. That's why Cheese is annoyed, and why I'm a bit perplexed.
I will second that, as I said in another thread. This may be what you do, but it's not what all gay guys are like. You are representing a subculture within a population, not the population at large.
They most certainly can, and do, and should. It's certainly not done often enough, but being straightforward with your intentions avoids pretty much any relationship problem.
You're right that people should but it's just not done and if you try to demand that kind of on-the-table honesty out of someone you're likely to just creep them out as nerds are wont to do.
I can readily think of multiple relationships, including my own, in which very early on the members were clear about what they wanted, needed, and expected from their partners. All of those relationships are still going strong. Getting the cards out and putting them on the table saves a lot of time, heartache, and arguments. If someone isn't willing to discuss their priorities and expectations early on, then they are either: i) too immature to know what they want, or ii) too immature to be honest about what they want. Either way, that simply isn't a person I would think anyone would want to get involved with (even on a casual level for fear that they may become overly attached).
The "what are we" talk really only comes into play once you've been dating for awhile though, that's not a second date proclamation.
I have a problem with this statement. If you think the second date doesn't mean monogamy, but the other person does, then you are in for some drama. This could all be avoided by a very simple up-front conversation saying, "hey, I'm not into non-exclusive dating. I'd like to date and get to know you to see if we're compatible, but I need you to not be sleeping with other people while that's going on."
You don't have to put a label on the relationship, but you need to know what each other's expectations are.
Nuri handed me what amounted to an instruction manual before we started dating.
Ladies, I highly suggest this course of action.
Fucking yes. One of the keys to a successful relationship is that both people are very clear on what will rapidly make it a very unsuccessful one. The reason love should mean never having to say you're sorry is because you are clear on what you would have to apologize for regarding it, and therefore, you don't do those things.
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The "what potential does it have" question is more about honest communication of what you're after: "I'm not looking for a serious relationship." "I want a fling." "I am looking for something more than just a fling, but you don't have to think about that right now. Let's revisit the topic in X time." Those are perfectly fine answers. The point is that they're actual answers.
And I don't want to dogpile on Gunter here. As I said, dude, I'm sorry. This is advice I'm giving out of my own experience, the stuff I've learned from going through a lot of the same stuff you're going through. What I can say is that you will probably fall flat a few more times before you figure it out. It sucks, but it's how it works for most people. Chin up, kiddo.
Also, people never announce out loud their honest, specific intentions with each other. Sure it would be nice if everyone was a truth telling android but that's just now how it works.
I think the the way this situation ended up comes down to a confluence of extreme emotional pressures on her part, not all of which came to light until a couple of nights ago. I may have been in denial for the last week of it, but it is how it is. Contrary to Code's advice, that stomach-flipping, lightheaded biochemical puppy love had faded. More than anything else I was caught up in her struggle as a person, and how she helped me through mine on a daily basis.
Kaptain K, while he can go eat a bag a leprous dicks, is right on one point. She was an emotionally confused and unstable person, and it was silly of me to get so involved in that. I'll be god damned if it didn't seem worth it until the other night, but what's worth it at the time clearly isn't always what's worth it in the end.
Also, I like how you guys seem to think that I've learned absolutely nothing from this experience. I'm smarter than I look, but the advice is appreciated all the same.
Gays don't have this problem though since we talk turkey right after "Hi". Although what follows usually isn't more than "what, where and when".
Were I gay and looking for casual sex, though, I know a couple of places that I would hit up. I do admit, you people know how to party.
A handful of them would also be very peeved at the simplification of 20+ year relationships to "what, where, when."
You don't have to put a label on the relationship, but you need to know what each other's expectations are.
P.s - Don't profess love on the first date. For fuck's sake.
Ladies, I highly suggest this course of action.