It's more that Otakon and Baltimore are synonymous with eachother and summer in my mind. Of course, with the big stuff we're planning for NYAF/NYCC and PAX, plus the addition of MAGfest to the lineup, it will in some ways be a welcome respite not to attend, simply for the fact that making arrangements on the back end is much more of a hassle than it is with any other convention for us.
We'll see how it goes, considering there's no panel schedule yet.
Edit: NS2 Alpha released July 26th. Awww, shit. ;^)
Ok you guys. Apparently Otakon actually noticed my post saying you should ask the same question over and over at the feedback session. I thought this would be necessary in order to show them how important these issues really are. I was under the assumption they just didn't get it. Much to my surprise, the convention staff have taken notice of this very thread. Therefore, enacting this plan will only hurt, not help, our cause. Still, the questions should be asked a least once each so the points are made clear, are on the record, and the room should be given a chance to cheer when you ask for the badges to be mailed.
Yes, but the question is if it will help that they have noticed. You guys have been singing this same old song to them for how long now?
Essentially, To Paraphrase Gaiman, Ideas ain't shit, if you can't turn talk into walk.
Essentially, To Paraphrase Gaiman, Ideas ain't shit, if you can't turn talk into walk.
The difference between Otakon and every other con we continue to work with is that they don't have the "put up or shut up" attitude right. Take Connecticon. They had a bad year many years ago, and we happened to be there. We panned the con in our review. The heads emailed us, and basically said the same things Otakon would always say. "Don't complain: step up and help us make it better." But when we said "Hells yeah," they said "Hells yeah" right back at us. Fast forward just a couple of years, and we're the heads of panels.
The difference between Otakon and every other con we continue to work with is that they don't have the "put up or shut up" attitude right. Take Connecticon. They had a bad year many years ago, and we happened to be there. We panned the con in our review. The heads emailed us, and basically said the same things Otakon would always say. "Don't complain: step up and help us make it better." But when we said "Hells yeah," they said "Hells yeah" right back at us. Fast forward just a couple of years, and we're the heads of panels.
They're hardly alone - many events have the same problem. They don't have the balls to tell people to put up or shut up, or they just go "Oh yeah, well, we're the ones running the show, and you're not, so we must know what we're talking about, and you don't, piss off."
They need to put boot to arse, essentially - Listen to the ideas, and use the ones that make good sense, and enact them, rather than cocking about. Listening to you guys on these matters would be a decent idea, too - When it comes to Conventions, you guys have your shit down.
And of course, if all else fails, Just pull a Tim Buckley, and do whatever Penny arcade and PAX does.
There is a pretty much 100% chance that this will be my last Otakon. While I don't have to put up with the kind of stuff Rym and Scott did (we didn't hear back about our panel until about two weeks ago, but we also weren't staff and didn't have to deal with that), I just... there's something ICKY about attending a con that I know is run like a frat house; that, and pretty much everyone in my group thinks Connecticon sounds like the bomb-diggity.
The only thing that actually bothers me personally (as opposed to things that hamper us professionally) is the tendency of Otakon staff to excuse problems by saying something along the lines of "we're just volunteers: don't expect too much from us, and if you don't like something, step up and fix it," but then not easily accepting anyone who is actually willing to step up.
The panels schedule is way late this year (Otakon 2010), as were panel acceptances. We were panels staff straight up, and at no point did anyone even once ask us for assistance. In fact, no one even told us that the head of panels changed until I emailed the entire department asking very pointedly what was going on, why we hadn't heard anything, and what they needed us to do. We offered constantly, months before now, to help sort and schedule panels, but no one seemed interested. So if they claim that the schedule was late due to lack of manpower, that's an outright lie. We were prepared and expecting to help them sort it out, but we were basically ignored.
The sad part is, the late schedule is the reason we can no longer attend this year. We waited for one as long as we could, but we have other obligations. If the schedule (which we were supposed to be helping with) had come out even a week earlier, there would have been at least two GeekNights panels on it.
The only thing that actually bothers me personally (as opposed to things that hamper us professionally) is the tendency of Otakon staff to excuse problems by saying something along the lines of "we're just volunteers: don't expect too much from us, and if you don't like something, step up and fix it," but then not easily accepting anyone who is actually willing to step up.
The only thing that actually bothers me personally (as opposed to things that hamper us professionally) is the tendency of Otakon staff to excuse problems by saying something along the lines of "we're just volunteers: don't expect too much from us, and if you don't like something, step up and fix it," but then not easily accepting anyone who is actually willing to step up.
That's kinda stupid, if they were lets say doing a lot of big changes and can't ANOTHER one I would accept that but in terms of policies what have they really changed? This isn't a small con attempting each year to grow itself, they are extremely established.
I suggest that we do a Geeknights Forumites Meet-Up on Thursday evening and get some dinner and go play some games. Objections?
I'd suggest you eat early (around 5:00pm or so) over by the nightclub district at one of those little bistros. That area sucks later, but it's nice before the sun goes down and the police show up. Just head over toward the Power Plant in a group.
The panels schedule is way late this year (Otakon 2010), as were panel acceptances. We were panels staff straight up, and at no point did anyone even once ask us for assistance. In fact, no one even told us that the head of panels changed until I emailed the entire department asking very pointedly what was going on, why we hadn't heard anything, and what they needed us to do. We offered constantly, months before now, to help sort and schedule panels, but no one seemed interested. So if they claim that the schedule was late due to lack of manpower, that's an outright lie. We were prepared and expecting to help them sort it out, but we were basically ignored.
Oh really. Well, looks like Eva Monkey didn't need to do everything by himself, with is how it seemed on the boards. I have a question, when it comes to choosing panels is it up to one person or a group? I wondered about that.
Oh really. Well, looks like Eva Monkey didn't need to do everything by himself, with is how it seemed on the boards. I have a question, when it comes to choosing panels is it up to one person or a group? I wondered about that.
At least this year, it was up to mostly one person, with some input from a small handful of others. No one ever asked us our opinion at any point, and our offers to help were largely rebuffed (they just said vaguely that they'd use us "at-con") for months.
For some context, I drove down to the Otakon staff meeting in January, and met with the panels department and the head (who was someone different then). I was surprised that Otakon starts planning panels so late, but otherwise we seemed good to go. We discussed plans and scheduling and everything, and things seemed on track.
No one ever contacted us again after that meeting, and all of my emails asking what they wanted us to help with went unanswered.
Four months later, in April, I just emailed the entire list of people in the panels department asking what was going on, and what they needed us to do. That was when Aaron Clark (evamonkey) responded to us, basically saying that the former head of panels was gone, and that he was then in charge. He had no idea of any of the planning we'd done at the staff meeting, and basically we were starting over. (Until this moment, we had no idea there had been any change).
We offered continuously to help from April onward, but there was no interest. He said he was overwhelmed by the 298 panel submissions (not that many more than we had for ConnectiCon), but didn't want any help in sifting through them (at least, not from us). We eventually stopped offering to help, as it was clear that Otakon didn't want us to do anything until the con itself. Three months later, with still no schedule or useful communication from the staff, we bailed on our panels.
Generally organizing the non-guest panels that are scheduled initially (sorting through the panel apps and scheduling out a rough panel schedule) is done by one or two people. I mean Rym did you have other people helping you in the initial scheduling and sorting of panels for C-con other then Scott? After that you might have other people look at it and definitely the Guest department and Chair. So not getting much response when you ofter to help doesn't sound too crazy or unexpected. Panels work is mainly at con managing with some scheduling and correspondence earlier.
I mean Rym did you have other people helping you in the initial scheduling and sorting of panels for C-con other then Scott?
No, but that was due solely to the fact that we had other unrelated problems (email submissions, which we did not expect to have to handle). We have a system for wide collaboration for next year, and once a panel is "approved," scheduling it can be handled by anyone. I fully expect to have one person per track scheduling panels, and aside from guest panels, we expect to have 90% of the con scheduled and confirmed a full two months out.
So not getting much response when you ofter to help doesn't sound too crazy or unexpected. Panels work is mainly at con managing with some scheduling and correspondence earlier.
The other trouble is that we joined specifically with the understanding that we'd help pre-con, which was discussed at length at the staff meeting I attended. To ignore us and then shift all of our work to at-con instead at the last minute was a whole different ballgame. The fact that there still isn't a schedule just amplified our own concerns, and I am confident that the panel schedule could have been ready much earlier with our assistance.
No, but that was due solely to the fact that we had other unrelated problems (email submissions, which we did not expect to have to handle). We have a system for wide collaboration for next year, and once a panel is "approved," scheduling it can be handled by anyone. I fully expect to have one person per track scheduling panels, and aside from guest panels, we expect to have 90% of the con scheduled and confirmed a full two months out.
I'm just saying that whoever took over probably figured that had the job handled himself, now I FULLY agree with you that a convention as big as Otakon shouldn't have just one dude HOPEFULLY putting together a schedule but it's not surprising that you were given a cold shoulder or a general meh to you're requests to help in panels before the convention because if you have a semi-competent panel head you SHOULD be able to handle the initial scheduling.
Two weeks away. Seriously... where the hell is the schedule? -_-
LESS THAN. Otakon starts 13 days from today and there's still no schedule.
I might bail out, if there is no schedule before the 23rd. I'm really weighing the amount of fun that is POSSIBLE by Otakon, on the cost of my hotel rooms.
Two weeks away. Seriously... where the hell is the schedule? -_-
LESS THAN. Otakon starts 13 days from today and there's still no schedule.
I might bail out, if there is no schedule before the 23rd. I'm really weighing the amount of fun that is POSSIBLE by Otakon, on the cost of my hotel rooms.
I'm not debating dropping out this year. I know that there will be awesome times to be had at Otakon. If worse comes to worse, it turns into the "Hang out with Li, Geo, Viga, and my pals" con.
Next year, however, I'm probably going to go to Connecticon rather than Otakon (I've said this like a dozen times, to the point that I'm kinda feeling like a jerk saying it). And I don't think it's just Otakon screwing up that's making other cons look better in comparison; my interests have drifted far from where they were even a year ago. I'm feeling much more the gaming and other sides of geekery much harder than before, and Otakon just can't cater to that part of me.
I might bail out, if there is no schedule before the 23rd. I'm really weighing the amount of fun that is POSSIBLE by Otakon, on the cost of my hotel rooms.
Okay, considering how good my money scenario really is and reflecting on the great times I had last year/Scrym's discussion of Connecticon, I will, 100% go. Still offering up lodging help to anyone who doesn't have it.
Wow. Considering there's still no public schedule (I have to assume they have one done internally), we couldn't have accepted our two confirmations and performed even if we'd waited. I really hope they don't have any last-minute bails as people with confirmed panels see that they're up against the COSplay, or too early on Friday, or too late on Sunday, or opposite one of the Hetalia panels.
Happily for ConnectiCon, our tracking system will basically obviate any dependencies that fan/professional panels will have on guest panels. But even then, I can't imagine the guest panels alone are the cause of the severe schedule delays for Otakon this year. The turnover of the department head doesn't really excuse it either, since that happened many months ago, and no one seemed interested in telling the rest of the department at the time, so it couldn't have been that big of a deal. What could possible have delayed it this long?
Comments
It's more that Otakon and Baltimore are synonymous with eachother and summer in my mind. Of course, with the big stuff we're planning for NYAF/NYCC and PAX, plus the addition of MAGfest to the lineup, it will in some ways be a welcome respite not to attend, simply for the fact that making arrangements on the back end is much more of a hassle than it is with any other convention for us.
We'll see how it goes, considering there's no panel schedule yet.
Edit: NS2 Alpha released July 26th. Awww, shit. ;^)
Essentially, To Paraphrase Gaiman, Ideas ain't shit, if you can't turn talk into walk.
They need to put boot to arse, essentially - Listen to the ideas, and use the ones that make good sense, and enact them, rather than cocking about.
Listening to you guys on these matters would be a decent idea, too - When it comes to Conventions, you guys have your shit down.
And of course, if all else fails, Just pull a Tim Buckley, and do whatever Penny arcade and PAX does.
And keep your face like this -> 8^U
The panels schedule is way late this year (Otakon 2010), as were panel acceptances. We were panels staff straight up, and at no point did anyone even once ask us for assistance. In fact, no one even told us that the head of panels changed until I emailed the entire department asking very pointedly what was going on, why we hadn't heard anything, and what they needed us to do. We offered constantly, months before now, to help sort and schedule panels, but no one seemed interested. So if they claim that the schedule was late due to lack of manpower, that's an outright lie. We were prepared and expecting to help them sort it out, but we were basically ignored.
The sad part is, the late schedule is the reason we can no longer attend this year. We waited for one as long as we could, but we have other obligations. If the schedule (which we were supposed to be helping with) had come out even a week earlier, there would have been at least two GeekNights panels on it.
For some context, I drove down to the Otakon staff meeting in January, and met with the panels department and the head (who was someone different then). I was surprised that Otakon starts planning panels so late, but otherwise we seemed good to go. We discussed plans and scheduling and everything, and things seemed on track.
No one ever contacted us again after that meeting, and all of my emails asking what they wanted us to help with went unanswered.
Four months later, in April, I just emailed the entire list of people in the panels department asking what was going on, and what they needed us to do. That was when Aaron Clark (evamonkey) responded to us, basically saying that the former head of panels was gone, and that he was then in charge. He had no idea of any of the planning we'd done at the staff meeting, and basically we were starting over. (Until this moment, we had no idea there had been any change).
We offered continuously to help from April onward, but there was no interest. He said he was overwhelmed by the 298 panel submissions (not that many more than we had for ConnectiCon), but didn't want any help in sifting through them (at least, not from us). We eventually stopped offering to help, as it was clear that Otakon didn't want us to do anything until the con itself. Three months later, with still no schedule or useful communication from the staff, we bailed on our panels.
Next year, however, I'm probably going to go to Connecticon rather than Otakon (I've said this like a dozen times, to the point that I'm kinda feeling like a jerk saying it). And I don't think it's just Otakon screwing up that's making other cons look better in comparison; my interests have drifted far from where they were even a year ago. I'm feeling much more the gaming and other sides of geekery much harder than before, and Otakon just can't cater to that part of me.
Happily for ConnectiCon, our tracking system will basically obviate any dependencies that fan/professional panels will have on guest panels. But even then, I can't imagine the guest panels alone are the cause of the severe schedule delays for Otakon this year. The turnover of the department head doesn't really excuse it either, since that happened many months ago, and no one seemed interested in telling the rest of the department at the time, so it couldn't have been that big of a deal. What could possible have delayed it this long?